vision21
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Posts posted by vision21
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Are you sure the shark cat boat and trailer weigh 2.5 ton? anyway I tow around 2.1 tons [21ft] with my Falcon with lowed suspension & auto trans cooler and I have never had any troubles at boat ramps or any other troubles mentioned here.
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I noticed a magazine called 'Go Boating' today at Newsagents it had comparisons done on the top brands in 175hp bracket, could be just showing specs only. I dont think it was water testing.
Tony.
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I painted mine with auto trans fluid and it still shines like a new trailer, its almost 2 years old. Salt has not attached itself anywhere.
Tony.
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Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents worth.
I have a 115 Etec and have had it for just over 12 months. It sits on the back of a 530 Haines.
All I will say if that if I was to buy another outboard tomorrow I would ensure it was an etec regardless of size.
You really cant go wrong with any of the top four brands.
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Buy yourself the OPTIMAX forget about all the free E-TEC DVD'S if they were that good you wouldn' be getting those CD's in your cornflakes box as well.All those yanks cant be wrong.
Tony.
No worrys Huey, dont tell me you thought I was a bit one sided did you?
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Buy yourself a counter sink tool, it looks like an upturned round triangle with a cutting edge. First drill your hole then use the counter sinker to cut your fibre glass so when you put the screw in it dose not lift the fibre glass edges.
Tony
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Buy yourself the OPTIMAX forget about all the free E-TEC DVD'S if they were that good you wouldn' be getting those CD's in your cornflakes box as well.All those yanks cant be wrong.
Tony.
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If you want an awesom sound buy infinity I bought them on ebay from the U.S to avoid paying double here. They will cost you about 200AU.
Tony.
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I thought electric brakes have nothing to do with getting wet since the 'electric pump' sits just behind the tow hitch [pumps brake fluid at high pressure to your calipers] my trailer gets wet all the time.
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Correct! See here for full spec:
Correct only for the ford standard tow kit which is 1600kg, you need a Hayman Reece towbar that would bring it up to 2300kg. Legal.
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Territory's guzzle fuel, nice car anyway check this site out. www.fordforums.com.au
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Hi Tony, I have never bashed any outboard-I have said that everyone is entitled to an opnion and all outboards made today are fine and if you want a 4-Stroke then that is your right. What I have done is tried to correct false statements and point out the differences in the technologies used in the DFI side of things and I think you are confused when I say it has two injectors per cylinder. The OPTI range DOES not have two fuel injectors per cylinder, they have ONE fuel injector or direct injector and the other is an air injector that sits on the fuel rail and without both operating the outboard will not run. It has nothing to do with high performance as you claim, but it is the way MERC see fit to get good fuel economy and emissions, but as of 2007 model year the large OPTI are only 2 star emission rating, but I am not sure why they have done that. I personally would rather not have to rely on a belt, a compressor and more components on my engine if I did not need them, but that is just me.
As I said in my previous post and Sam has said this is way off the topic and I will bow out of this discussion now because it is getting nowhere and there will always be the mine is better than yours argument and I wish every boater many years of trouble free boating no matter what brand or technology they run.
Huey.
No worries Huey, I didnt really mean you where doing the brand bashing I was refering to Ross and the boating fraternity being fierce which it is, but I guess in a thread like this its easy to ruffle feathers.
Anyway, the air injector does enhance performance similar to a turbo charger, if you can force air and fuel into a combustion chamber under pressure [injection] we all know what that means that is'' higher performance''
air injectors are common in high performance automotive turbo engines to increase responce before the turbo ''wakes the engine''
2007 opti could have had 3 star rating but at the expence of less HP. Those star ratings remind me of the yellow tick on food packages. [pay the foundation and you will get the rating]
Im done with this too, time to go fishing.
Tony.
No worries Huey, I didnt really mean you where doing the brand bashing I was refering to Ross and the boating fraternity being fierce which it is, but I guess in a thread like this its easy to ruffle feathers.
Anyway, the air injector does enhance performance similar to a turbo charger, if you can force air and fuel into a combustion chamber under pressure [injection]will all know what that means that is'' higher performance''
air injectors are common in high performance automotive turbo engines to increase responce before the turbo ''wakes the engine''
2007 opti could have had 3 star rating but at the expence of less HP. Those star ratings remind me of the yellow tick [heart foundation] on food packages. [pay the foundation and you will get the rating]
Im done with this too, time to go fishing.
Tony.
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You have hit the nail on the head Vision , ones mans meat is another mans poison. Brand loyalty ,as you have no doubt noticed is very fierce in the boating fraternity , but this is not to say that my motor is better than yours , it is just my preference.
Care to enlighten us as to why your Ford is better than a Holden?
Ross
Give this man a BEER! Ross thats exactly what I was getting at, [its called brand bashing] I spent months or almost a year looking at engines you cannot go wrong with any brand but I did find if YOU dont know what is going on out there nobody will tell you. It is best to try and learn something about the machanics of the engine in question. I found induction systems where hardly ever explained by dealers CARBY,EFI,DFI,FOUR STROKE if you didnt know anything about it they will have you think that there brand is light years ahead and nobody has the same offerings but it did not take long to work out what was going on here and which company spent big dollars on marketing.
There has been a few classic examples e.g fan belts that can break, air pumps that can break[piston conrod] price of parts, but the funiest is ''2 INJECTORS PER CYLINDER'' being a bad thing. Let me tell you that any engine that employs 2 injectors per cylinder in either marine or especially automotive spells HIGH PERFORMANCE this is RACE ENGINE TECHNOLOGY not to mention supperior throttle responce and in some cases 1 injector per cylinder operating at low RPM only to increase economy [is it called ECO FRIENDLY]untill the throttle is cranked then hang on. AGAIN, ANY ENGINE WITH 2 INJECTORS PER CYLINDER IS HIGH PERFORMANCE and in RACE ENGINE TERRITORY.
Remember the operating systems in these engines are not unique to outboareds. There is a brand out there that uses there car engines for there 4stroke range. [modified]
Now guys, its not all Bathurst you know I can switch on the TV anytime and see a FORD competing anywhere in the world in either classic or Formula 1 thats why Ford is better.
Anyway why would anybody have somthing if it wasnt the best.
Tony.
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They use less fuel because they are designed better , and burn the fuel more efficiently than the other brands.
As for them being more expensive , thats not a sales pitch , just a simple statement of fact , but you do get an awful lot of engine for your dollar.
Ross
Well I reckon my Ford is better than a Holden.
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Hi Vision, thank-you for your post BUT when I mentioned apples to apples I was talking price. The E-TEC has SST prop and three year service intervals so that needs to be added to the price of any carby engine. This can be upwards of $1500 so the E-TEC and a carby can cost the same and if you read my next sentence I list the benefits of an E-TEC compared to a carby and yes you can not compare the two.
You are entitled to your opinion and IF you owned an E-TEC you could drain the gear oil as much as you like, what BRP are doing is saying with the the high performance gear oil they run in the E-TEC it can last for 3 years or 300 hours and we have seen many E-TEC now that have done those hours or are older than 3 years and the gear oil is fine-we drain the old stuff and fill with new HPF oil and the customer is good to go for another 3 years if they so choice. All we say to our customers is to remove the prop occansionally and make sure that there is no fishing line caught around the propshaft causing the seal to fail-this should be done with any outboard-it is just commonsense. BRP are backing the E-TEC with a 3 year warranty, but if you want to replace the oil yearly or every 6 months, no problem-it is upto the owner. We have some E-TEC owners that are getting their E-TEC serviced every year, but please realise that not many outboards are going to do 300 hours in 3 years, the average an otuboard does in one year is 40 hours so at 120 hours that gear oil will be fine.
The Orbitial engine company in WA was only one of the pioneers of DFI 2-Stroke, and early on OMC had engines running with their technology even before Merc, BUT they discovered a better, simpler system made by a German family called Ficht, so they purchased the rights to that technology and what we see today in the E-TEC is the second generation of that technology, but just much better at doing what it is supposed to do- that is produce more HP with better emissions and fuel economy than the earlier design. The E-TEC system in our opinion, is a much better system than the Optimax / HPDI or TLDI system becasue it does not require a compressor, belt to drive that compressor(which do break) or high pressure fuel pump to atomize the fuel. All those parts plus many more parts in the other systems can cause the outboard to fail and you will never see the other brands go down to the HP that Arif asked about in the first place. BRP have had 9.9HP E-TEC engines running and it is my guess that by this time next year we will be selling 25HP and 30HP E-TEC outboards that will be excellent for the 3.9-4.5M tinny market which is so popular here. I personally can not wait to try one instead of being forced to run a gutless and heavy 30HP 4-Stroke which is all that is avaiable to us today if you want a clean outboard.
Have a nice day,
Huey.
No worries Huey,
OK, in your post you say, ''The E-Tec will out perform both the Mercury and the Yamaha, and use about 50% less fuel and are a nicer engine'' so why will it use 50% less fuel than the others? ALSO ''the are a little bit more expensive than others'' well they are, when you compare them to EFI and CARBY . I think by saying they are a ''little bit more expensive than the others'' is a sales pitch. The bloke would go away and tell his wife ' I want that E-TEC they cost more, so it must be better. I would say if Arif bought the engine is was based on my last comment. I would have any of the brands mentioned as they are all proven products and you dont have to OWN the E-Tec to comment on it. To sales pitchy for me.
I wish you a nice day to Huey.
Tony.
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Good Morning Arif, good question you ask and you are correct. Every brand of outboard have families of engines, which run the same powerhead but have different carbies, or with the newer EMM controlled engines have a different fuel map/program. When comparing brands of outboard engines the cubic capacity of the engine is most important when it comes to the performance and the stress levels on the outboard to produce the quoted HP. The two engines you are considering are both good outboards but the Mercury 50/60HP is a much more powerful engine because it 967cc engine compared to only 698cc for the 50HP Yamaha and 849cc for the 60HP Yamaha. Also having three year warranty vs two year warranty is a benefit that the Merc has.
Depending on your boat I think the 50HP Mercury offers the best performing outboard out of the two you mentioned. What I would look at also is a 50HP E-TEC Evinrude, it will cost you more but offers better value for money considering you get a SST prop standard and 3 year service intervals which can add about $2000 to the cost of a carby 2-Stroke when you compare "apples to apples"-that is SST prop for the Merc or Yamaha and the service costs. The E-TEC will outperform both the Mercury and Yamaha, use about 50% less fuel and be a much nicer engine to own and operate with a lot less noise and without any smoke or cold start issues. Also we hardly sell any more carby 2-Strokes, nobody really wants them-even though on "face value" they are cheaper. What I see in the future is the re-sale value of these engines are not going to be great compared to an E-TEc, so the extra money you have to spend on an E-TEC will easily repay you come time to upgrade, and for the life of the outboard you have a MUCH better engine.
I hope this helps,
Huey.
Comparying apples to apples eh ?? isnt the E-tec range of motors DFI if thats the case this is NOT a fair comparison you cannot compare any EFI, or Carby engine to DFI. I dont think keeping gear box oil in for 3 years is such a good idea. Dont forget DFI was invented by an Australian Ralphf Saric [ok yugoslav origin] he sold DFI orbital engine technology to the USA MERCURY because we thought he was a nutter. Enough said.
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Hey all,
Isn't there something in NSW about the weight of the vehicle being more than three quarters of the weight of the thing being towed or similar, I know I haven't gotten it completely right but you get the drift. What has been said about the capacity of the engine/drive train and breaks, traction etc all true and good points.
Brenton
Hey Brenton,
I bought my boat last June and I tow it with my 1998 EL Ford six all up its just under 2000kg. The towing capacity is 2300kg I spoke to the RTA and they say as long as you dont exceed the manufactures towing recomendations your fine, same story with my insurance company so once all that was sorted out I bought the boat. Did some mods to the car but it towes very well and stable lots of power but braking earlier has to be in your mind all the time to avoid idiots.
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I dont want to confirm or deny anyones claims here. But high speeds are possible in 'Cats.
This boat with twin 175's will do a (GPS indicated) 45knots easy in the calm, and hit 48- 50knots (92.5km/h) with a bit of trimming. Thats with nearly 500 litres of fuel on board.
Its a 1988ish 23 foot SharkCat
I am more inclined to believe these facts.
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Hair drier on hot to soften the glue, dont use a heat gun.
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Top speed of 130 Kph? Australian Boating mag have a review on this exact boat and they say top speed of 42knots just under 80kph either way I wouldnt mind having it.
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Mik,
I would put it as shown in your first example, it looks far enough from the strake and will get the clean flow of water.
I did the same job on my boat a few months ago I just didnt like the idea of drilling holes in it.
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I got an XR6. So if you are a holden fan its crappy
I think I might get a bottle jack. More thinking about the load capacity, should that be of concern as its 1600 basically on 3 wheels. So its gonna do more work than on the car.Thanks for your reply.
Chris
Nothing wrong with that car jack, I have the same type. The times I have used it on the trailer I place it underneath the spring pad to lift the wheel off the ground instead of lifting the whole trailer then if Im not in a hurry I'll use a stand or something just in case. Why worry about the load on the jack? it never has the full GVM on it when lifting the corner of your car or boat.
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Hey Elliot,
I use a cover on my 225optimax made it myself but the only reason I use it is to stop my mates sinkers and hooks bashing and scratching the cowl.
I bought 15mm sound proof spong from a carparts place and my wife made a black vinyl skin to go over it with openings out the back for the air intake. Its has stopped alot of the engine sound aswell.
Originally I was just going to use 15mm spong but the sound proof material was a better after thought.
I dont leave it on at home it normaly needs to be washed anyway.
I found no differance with engine temp, being a black cowl you could fry an egg on it on sunny days.
Tony.
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Was heading to Apple tree bay on saturday morning but last minute change now we are going to Botany Bay instead.
I really need to catch a decent sized fish soon!
I think I might get a bottle jack. More thinking about the load capacity, should that be of concern as its 1600 basically on 3 wheels. So its gonna do more work than on the car.
Towing Capabilities
in Boating
Posted · Edited by vision21
Good point, anything around the 2 ton mark can be towed easily with a tow rating of around 2300kg, According to RTA when I spoke to them as long as you dont exceed manufactures towing capacity its legal same goes with Shannons insurance [yes the old 6 cyl falcon with 240,000klm and Hayman Reese towbar 600 Bucks] I have been doing it for years, down to Ulladulla up to Port Macquarie, Bobin Head, Botany Bay You name it and my auto and engine has never over heated, burnt this or that. I can climb any hill faster than most 4wd [except for a V8 land cruiser that showed me how its done with his 24ft Mustang on the back] A bloke on the F3 overtook me with his 4wd last summer and almost wiped me out when his rig started snaking all over the place. I reckon big 4wd and BIG boats do have a purpose but dont put all you confidents in one it really depends on your driving skills and knowing whats going on around you on the road you just cant day dream when driving with a big boat on the back 4WD or 2WD.