New Yamaha 40 Veto (l) - Trouble Starting

[rodf]

Howdy Raiders,

I was hoping someone might be able to steer me right here.

I upgraded my tinnie to a nice new 4.35 Quintrex CoastRunner (forward steering) that came with a 2 stroke (3 cylinder) 40 Yammy VETO.

I bought the boat/motor new and its now done 21 hours. Great boat, I love it!!!

I had no trouble starting the motor prior to its first service (at 10 hours), however after it was serviced by a Yamaha dealer (no names here), I'm now having trouble starting the motor at the boat ramp - it takes me a good 5-10 minutes of cranking the engine before it fires. Once it starts, no problem for the rest of the day, it starts first time every time!!!

When I take the boat out a week or two weeks later, same routine - 5-10 minutes cranking before the motor fires. I'm sure I sometimes flood it, so I sit around for a few minutes and try again.

When I get home after each outing, I connect the 'ear muffs' and flush the motor for about 5 minutes.

Just to try something different, I recently disconnected the fuel line when I flushed the motor and let it run dry.

But when I took the boat out yesterday, same problem.

Am I doing something obviously wrong here???

Any advice greatly appreciated.

Rod

[pelican]

Howdy Raiders,

I was hoping someone might be able to steer me right here.

I upgraded my tinnie to a nice new 4.35 Quintrex CoastRunner (forward steering) that came with a 2 stroke (3 cylinder) 40 Yammy VETO.

I bought the boat/motor new and its now done 21 hours. Great boat, I love it!!!

I had no trouble starting the motor prior to its first service (at 10 hours), however after it was serviced by a Yamaha dealer (no names here), I'm now having trouble starting the motor at the boat ramp - it takes me a good 5-10 minutes of cranking the engine before it fires. Once it starts, no problem for the rest of the day, it starts first time every time!!!

When I take the boat out a week or two weeks later, same routine - 5-10 minutes cranking before the motor fires. I'm sure I sometimes flood it, so I sit around for a few minutes and try again.

When I get home after each outing, I connect the 'ear muffs' and flush the motor for about 5 minutes.

Just to try something different, I recently disconnected the fuel line when I flushed the motor and let it run dry.

But when I took the boat out yesterday, same problem.

Am I doing something obviously wrong here???

Any advice greatly appreciated.

Rod

Rod I can't imagime you are doing anything wrong. No modern motor should take more than a few seconds cranking to kick and no more than a couple of cranks to start.

Something is up be it the user, fuel pump or electrics in the kill switch , key or such

Since you have had it serviced my first answer is give the bloke who serviced it a call and ask if you could drive by and try and start it in front of them on muffs with your normal routine just like going to the ramp. They may quickly pick up if you are not doing something and if it doesn't start straight away then they are there to look and see what is up with it.

Crazy questions that might seem dumb but might help diagonose your issue. No idea how mechanical adept you are.

Do you pump the fuel bulb until firm??? If not the fuel pumps aren't very good or fast at sucking up fuel especially if there is any air leaks in the hose or connections.

Fuel bulb arrow pointing right way towards motor?

Is the boat fitted with fuel filters? Are they clear and clean?

Do you use the choke- does it have a manual choke?

What throttle setting do you use when starting?

Kill switch definetly positively on? Check it works to stop motor as well?

Battery in good nick?

Compression test when they serviced it?

Note to everyone - every service get a compression test and keep the numbers- it will tell you the first sign of possible issues with all 2 strokes along with the colour of old spark plugs.

A lot of wear will occur on your starter , battery and electrics if you don't sort it and you may be stranded premeturely by a failed starter component as they wern't designed for that sort of duty.

Be good to hear back when you solve it.

[caine]

i have the same engine and have no problems

do you give its some revs whilst turning the key???? i often have to when the engine is cold

[rodf]

Thanks for responding guys,

Pelican, I'll attempt to answer your questions first...

Do you pump the fuel bulb until firm??? If not the fuel pumps aren't very good or fast at sucking up fuel especially if there is any air leaks in the hose or connections.

YEP, I DO PUMP THE FUEL BULB, USUALLY 2 OR 3 TIMES MORE ONCE I FEEL THE FIRMNESS IN THE BULB.

Fuel bulb arrow pointing right way towards motor? YES, NO PROBLEM THERE.

Is the boat fitted with fuel filters? Are they clear and clean?

NOT SURE, BUT I IMAGINE IT IS FITTED WITH A FUEL FILTER AND AS THE BOAT HAS ONLY DONE 21 HOURS I WOULD HOPE THAT IT IS CLEAN/CLEAR. ONCE I GET THE MOTOR GOING IT IS FINE FOR THE REST OF THE DAY, STARTS FIRST TIME EVERYTIME WITH ONLY A SHORT (1 SECOND) TURN OF THE KEY.

Do you use the choke- does it have a manual choke?

THE CHOKE IS ON THE KEY MECHANISM - YOU PUSH THE KEY IN WHILE TURNING IT, AND THAT ACTIVATES THE CHOKE. I DON'T USE THE CHOKE AGAIN FOR THE REST OF THE OUTING.

What throttle setting do you use when starting?

I WAS TOLD BY THE DEALER TO HAVE THE THROTTLE SET AT ABOUT 30 DEGREES WHEN STARTING FOR THE FIRST TIME AFTER A LONG LAYOFF OR WHEN THE ENGINE IS COLD. NOTE THAT THERE IS NO REAL DIFFERENCE IN THE REVS AT THIS SETTING, THAN WHEN NOT USING THE THROTTLE AT ALL. HOWEVER THE DEALER TOLD ME TO DO IT....SO I DO IT!

Kill switch definetly positively on? Check it works to stop motor as well?

YEP, DONE THIS.

Battery in good nick?

PERFECT, ALTHOUGH SPENDING 5-10 MINUTES TRYING TO START THE MOTOR EACH OUTING WILL SHORTEN ITS LIFE.

Compression test when they serviced it?

DON'T KNOW, BUT I WILL BE GETTING THE MOTOR SERVICED THIS WEEK OR NEXT, SO I WILL ASK.

Caine,

As mentioned above I set the throttle at about 30 degrees, but as you have the same motor, you would know that it doesn't appear to make any difference to the revs at 30 degrees....it's only when you raise the lever higher to about 60 degrees that the revs starting increasing.

Thanks again guys, I'll update you when I get the motor serviced.

Rod

[pelican]

Always start with the easy ones

Filters somtime cause inconsistancies but not your exact symptoms that is why I mentioned it.

Mentioned compression as motors with poor compression are hard to start cold. At only 21 hours I would be very surprised if you had an issue.

Last easy check- Choke

With cowl off and someone pressing the key just check the choke solonoid on the motor is actually operating linkages and choking the motor.

Caine may well have the right idea in regards to a little throttle on starting. On many control boxes the first 30 deg only operates the shift quadrant and then the throttle quadrant starts to open. On our old boat we actually marked on the throttle box with some liquid paper where it actually started with a few revs so we could put it there on cold starts. With the cowl off it is usually easy to see when the throttle starts to move and to can mark it on your control box and feel more comfortable about moving it to that spot straight away and not having the motor revs run away from you.

As with any motor don't let it rev on start up as it creates a lot of wear when they are cold and the bearings and mechanicals aren't warm or properly lubricated.

Hope caine's method solves your problem.

Pel

Edited January 14, 2008 by pelican

[caine]

Caine,

As mentioned above I set the throttle at about 30 degrees, but as you have the same motor, you would know that it doesn't appear to make any difference to the revs at 30 degrees....it's only when you raise the lever higher to about 60 degrees that the revs starting increasing.

Rod

i dont leave it in one place ! i move it from 30 to 60 or more!. like ya would when staring a cold old car.

but dont trust me, i have no idea.

check with the dealer cause i dont have the same dramas, mine will often start dead cold, first turn of the key with no throttle

[IWANNABROCK]

sounds like choke not choking engine and taking a while for fuel to suck up. I had an old 40h.p pull start johnson, mechanical choke lever was worn and broken, that was a bitch to start.

[CiViC]

check with the dealer cause i dont have the same dramas, mine will often start dead cold, first turn of the key with no throttle

i was under the impression that it had an automatic choke (providing the throttle isnt raised). once primed it should simply be turn the key (without pressing it in).

[mr magoo]

i was under the impression that it had an automatic choke (providing the throttle isnt raised). once primed it should simply be turn the key (without pressing it in).

not sure if this will help ,i have a 130 yamie i know its a different motor but just in case it helps

my engine just about has to be level to start when cold ,i know this seems strange but its true when cold it has to be level or very close to it ,to start.when trimed up takes a while to start.

hope that works for you ,arman

[chrisg]

Rod

I reckon the choke solenoid is not working...failed or a wire may have been removed during service and not put back.

As said when its quiet take the cowl off and push the key in...you should hear a click. If not that could be the problem.

Cheers

Chris

[a boat]

HI Rod, good advise from the guys. From what you are saying I would be guessing the choke is either not functioning (ie faulty solinoid, wiring etc) or is out of adjustment so that the choke butterflys are not fully closing in the carbys. If you have just had it serviced get in touch with them and get them to fix it-should not cost you anything due to a faulty part being under warranty or to adjust the plunger only takes 5 minutes.

Hope you get it sorted,

Cheers,

Huey.

[rodf]

Hey Guys,

Thanks for all your replies and advice.

I checked the choke, and it doesn't appear to be working!!!

I removed the cowling and got my son to push the key in while I had my big ear up against the motor, and there was definately no mechanical noise of any type when the key was pushed in.

This makes perfect sense to me. Its always been an issue when the motor is cold, never warm.

I've booked the motor in for a service next week, so hopefully all will be resolved then.

Thanks again,

Rod