zephi Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 (edited) I have a Shimano stradic 6000 FI since December 09. It hasn't really been used that much, but lately I've found that the drag is really acting up... I'm not too sure what's happening. When I set my drag very loose to allow the fish to run initially, then tighten up and set the hooks. On low to medium drag settings, the drag self tightens and pretty much the drag increases by A LOT. When I first noticed it, I pulled the line out quickly and would notice the drag clicking away as the line came out. It would stop eventually when the drag reaches probably about 2kg or more drag pressure. I'm not too sure about these drag discs, but when I first purchased this reel they came dry and I'm not sure about this whole dry/wet drag. The drag discs have a black coating which rubs off easily. IS this supposed to be run dry or what or am I supposed to grease it up? I believe this is the main cause of this very bad drag on this reel.. Edit: I forgot to add, when I adjust the drag when drag settings are low, the whole spool spins as well... Can anyone shed some light on this issue? I would love to have my reel up and running perfectly for the summer. Thanks a lot Edited October 1, 2010 by zephi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 Check out the post entitled "shouldn't have fiddled...." by flat boy in the reel and tackle maintainence forum, he was faced with the same issue could help you solve your problem. Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewhunter Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 Over to you Slinky!! Cheers, Grant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 4, 2010 Author Share Posted October 4, 2010 Check out the post entitled "shouldn't have fiddled...." by flat boy in the reel and tackle maintainence forum, he was faced with the same issue could help you solve your problem. Daniel Thanks Daniel I read it, it was interesting with similar issues but I know for sure my drag discs are in the right order. Over to you Slinky!! Cheers, Grant. Thanks Grant, hopefully he will be able to help here. I was hoping he will see this post soon as he is very knowledgeable about drags systems ^^ (based on the help he has given to other members in the reel maintenance section). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 4, 2010 Author Share Posted October 4, 2010 Oh yeah I forgot to mention this. Slinky, after reading about those carbontex fibres, I actually decided to order some, and get some reel grease from smoothdrag. Would this by any chance solve this issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 4, 2010 Share Posted October 4, 2010 If that other post did not help the only other possible issues that I can think of are either your drag washers have worn down causing the drag knob to make contact with the spool instead of the stack or possibly could be the small washer (generally a red colour) which sits under the spool on the clicker gear has worn/slipped down the shaft past the grooved section of it causing the spool to catch on lower end of the bail casing. This has happened to me on a penn reel before. Slinky might have other ideas also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 4, 2010 Author Share Posted October 4, 2010 (edited) Actually mate, you might be right about the drag washers being worn down and causing drag knob to make contact, but still it shouldnt make the whole spool spin. I'll actually swap some of the washers from new spool and place on the old one to check if it does the same, and let you know asap.. If it does then you're right about washers wearing down EDIT: No good, it still does the same thing. I really have no idea why when the line is pulled with minimal drag, it would self-tighten up. Imagine fighting a fish and the drag increases all of a sudden.. Edited October 4, 2010 by zephi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 When you say the spool spins I guess your refering to when you a winding line back on? When winding only the bailarm should spin arounding, but when line is being stripped off the spool should spin but the drag knob should remain still. The main shaft only moves up and down so that cannot be the reason. The drag could only keep tightening if the knob is making contact with a rotating part. Most probably the spool. Do you have a metal washer in the drag stack at the top where the drag knob is? If not the drag washer making contact to the drag knob could grab causing the knob to turn. Is there any obstruction under the drag knob causing it to catch? Ie the retaining spring not sitting in the designated groove properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 8, 2010 Author Share Posted October 8, 2010 nahh mate only when something pulls drag out, the drag knob will spin with the spool, and thus making the drag pressure increase. Drag will stop self tightening after it reaches a threshold of probably 1.5kg-2kg Most probably the knob is making contact with the spool. The drag discs are correctly placed in order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 Give the top of the spool + top drag metal washer and the drag knob a good clean, and when you get the grease with the new drag washers place some on these areas also to remove any friction. You could also use some innox on a rag and rub down these areas and see if that helps for the intermin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooklineandsinker Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 (edited) could your problem be the drag knob itself? it seems to me that it may be your problem does the spool spin fine with no drag knob on the reel like it should does it click when you tighten the drag knob Edited October 8, 2010 by hooklineandsinker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 Another issue I just thought of could be the thread at the top of the shaft or thread in the lower knob could be worn/damaged causing the slightest friction to turn the knob and it only grabs when it reachs the good part of thread, when the drag is around 2kg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evets Posted October 8, 2010 Share Posted October 8, 2010 Zephi When you swapped over some of the drag with another did you replace the whole stack? Or just a few? Your post said that you'd swap a few over. Id give all of the drag surfaces a really good clean. The black "washers" may have a small amount of grease on them and the grease has broken down which is making the whole stack stick together. Or they may have worn either way they need to be cleaned really well. In fact Id clean the entire drag stack, inside of the spool, drag knob and the shaft they all go onto. Id use something like turps for the spool and drag stack. The other thing I can think of is that the metal washers may not be completely flat. When they are made they are stamped out of large sheet of metal. Sometimes they aren't quite perfect. With a bit of wear they can catch and stick to each other. To check the flatness you need to get a permanent texta and colour in one side of the metal washers. Id then get some fine wet and dry sand paper and put it on a glass table. Put the washer texta side down on the wet and dry and rub it gently for about 30 seconds. Turn it over and have a look to see of the texta has worn away evenly. If it hasnt then there are low/high spots on the metal washer. These need to be fixed by either rubbing them down as described or replacing them with new ones. Dont forget to do both sides of the washer as well. Evets BTW: When you replace the stack put a tiny amount of grease on both sides of the black washers. When your carbon fibre washers arrive rub the grease into them and wipe 99.0% of it off as per Alan Tanis wise counsel. Too much grease will stop the stack from spinning properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinkymalinky Posted October 10, 2010 Share Posted October 10, 2010 G'day Zephi, Sorry for the slow response... I've been in Tassie at a funeral The problem is that for some reason your drag knob, rather than remaining stationery when the spool is releasing line against the drag, is turning with the spool. The top washer of a drag stack should also be stationery relative to the spool when the spool is releasing line. You'll be able to see if this is an issue by taking off the drag knob and turning the spool in the direction the line would run out... if the metal drag washer that is on top of the stack is turning, then it's a problem although unless the keyed hole is damaged I can't imagine how it would happen. I'd be really surprised if it's due to the washers being worn... it's hard to tell from the photo but they look ok. The non-metal washers look like Dartanium washers... hard to tell from the photo... they need to be clean and then can be very lightly greased with drag grease (just 'fingerprint' it on). But this shouldn't effect the drag knob... only make sure the drag is smooth. Sounds to me though, like the drag washers are in the wrong order or the drag knob or spool are damaged. From your photo I'm not sure which washer you have on top of the stack... let me know. If it's not that then I'd need to be able to eyeball it. Take it in to Global Tackle and ask them to see if they can tell what's going on. Cheers, Slinky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 11, 2010 Author Share Posted October 11, 2010 Thanks everyone for all the replies and contributions. Also sorry to hear about that Slinky. I'm sorta leaning towards the drag knob itself which is causing the problem. But it could also be because of the lack of grease in the drag washers. I'm waiting for the carbontex washers and cals universal grease to arrive. Then try upgrading to those washers and lightly smearing a fingerprint of grease on each washer. If it doesn't help then we definitely know its not the drag washers themselves which is causing the problem. Then we can say its probably the drag knob itself. Which I'll take it in to get it serviced and have it checked on. Could there be any other contributing factors which I should consider apart from the drag washers and drag knob? Slinky, the drag washers are lined up from left to right, what you see in the photo is the top side of each washer. Drag stack doesn't spin when the drag knob is removed. Drag stack is in the right order, I followed the sequence from the spare spool I got just in case. Spare spool also has the same issue, but the drag washers in there are lightly covered in grease, but this grease has become very tacky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinkymalinky Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 Thanks everyone for all the replies and contributions. Also sorry to hear about that Slinky. I'm sorta leaning towards the drag knob itself which is causing the problem. But it could also be because of the lack of grease in the drag washers. I'm waiting for the carbontex washers and cals universal grease to arrive. Then try upgrading to those washers and lightly smearing a fingerprint of grease on each washer. If it doesn't help then we definitely know its not the drag washers themselves which is causing the problem. Then we can say its probably the drag knob itself. Which I'll take it in to get it serviced and have it checked on. Could there be any other contributing factors which I should consider apart from the drag washers and drag knob? Slinky, the drag washers are lined up from left to right, what you see in the photo is the top side of each washer. Drag stack doesn't spin when the drag knob is removed. Drag stack is in the right order, I followed the sequence from the spare spool I got just in case. Spare spool also has the same issue, but the drag washers in there are lightly covered in grease, but this grease has become very tacky. So the metal washer on the left hand side in the photo is on top of the stack, right? Then it's not the order of the drag washers. Greasing the washers won't solve the problem because the issue isn't with the dartanium washers (or carbontex if you do an upgrade). The drag knob is spinning with the spool so it must be something to do with the drag knob. Have you disassembled the drag knob at any stage or is the spool damaged in any way? Cheers, Slinky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 11, 2010 Author Share Posted October 11, 2010 So the metal washer on the left hand side in the photo is on top of the stack, right? Then it's not the order of the drag washers. Greasing the washers won't solve the problem because the issue isn't with the dartanium washers (or carbontex if you do an upgrade). The drag knob is spinning with the spool so it must be something to do with the drag knob. Have you disassembled the drag knob at any stage or is the spool damaged in any way? Cheers, Slinky That's right, left side is top of the stack. I've never disassembled the drag knob up until I found out about the issue, in fact I took it apart today to have a look at it, and reassembled it the same way. Didn't tinker with anything though. Put everything back into place and screwed it back on, and the issue is still there. One little thing, does the waterproof drag rubber seal require any lubrication? That's the other thing which touches the spool. There is no damage to the spool whatsoever, I've even put my spare spool on to test it, and it also faces the same issue. Thanks for helping out Slinky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 To see if its the waterproof seal causing the issue remove it from the drag knob if possible and see if it corrects the issue. On my soron I use a light coat of cals on the waterproof washer for extra protection, there is no harm in doing so. Regards Woodch0p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 12, 2010 Author Share Posted October 12, 2010 To see if its the waterproof seal causing the issue remove it from the drag knob if possible and see if it corrects the issue. On my soron I use a light coat of cals on the waterproof washer for extra protection, there is no harm in doing so. Regards Woodch0p oooh Thanks so much, I didn't know it was removable so when I took it off, and tried it again. It worked perfectly!! Although I want to keep the waterproof seal on it, would adding grease reduce the friction on it? Currently I don't think I've got enough grease on it. Still waiting for the cals grease to arrive which should be arriving real soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 12, 2010 Share Posted October 12, 2010 Put a little bit of grease on it to see if it fixes it, it should but if not order a new washer should only be a couple of dollars, and its cheaper then a new drag knob! Glad to help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodch0p Posted October 13, 2010 Share Posted October 13, 2010 Just a quick note only grease the underside of the washer facing the drag stack, make sure the top of the washer facing the knob isn't greased. It could cause it to stick to the spool lip causing it to spin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 no good mate, its not the spool itself, its the waterproof seal. Drag is fine with the grease, I've done all that, its just the drag knob is still sticking due to waterproof seal rubbing on the spool probably. Even with grease on the waterproof seal didn't do much. Probably need to take it to shimano to get a new one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steze Posted October 15, 2010 Share Posted October 15, 2010 no good mate, its not the spool itself, its the waterproof seal. Drag is fine with the grease, I've done all that, its just the drag knob is still sticking due to waterproof seal rubbing on the spool probably. Even with grease on the waterproof seal didn't do much. Probably need to take it to shimano to get a new one thats probably the best way to go mate. At least you know they can definitely rectify the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zephi Posted October 27, 2010 Author Share Posted October 27, 2010 Thanks everyone for the help. I took the reel to Shimano servicing center and they gave me a drag knob and it fixed the issue right away! Very happy customer now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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