Help needed 30hp or 40hp

[Guest Guest123456789]

Hi raiders,

I have a decision to make regarding outboard purchase and am really confused. I need some help please.

The hull is a stacer rampage 429. It weighs 200kg, beam is 1.87, topsides 1.6mm with 3mm bottom sides.

Currently I have ordered a Suzuki 30hp 2 stroke but th dealer has kindly agreed to change this (but advises strongly against it).

I'm asking for a Suzuki 40hp 4 stroke. The dealer strongly feels the extra 50kg weight (total weight 104kg) will be too much and the boat will handle poorly. I trust the dealer, seems like a genuine guy but he did admit he has never driven a rampage with a 40hp (he has driven a 449 seahorse with the 40 and thought it was too stern heavy).

Has anyone got or had either a rampage or Quintrex busta (or similar) with a 40hp 4 stroke on the back? Does it work for you or is it too stern heavy? If you add weight to the front, how much clearance above the waterline do you have and do you get chop spilling over the topsides?

I'm against the 2 strokes mainly because of the noise and environmental issues but also the resale and I fear I won't have the grunt when the oat is loaded up with passengers and gear. Too much power is ok, too little is a problem. The 30hp 4 stroke isn't an option as the torque I've been told (by dealer and also others on the net) is insufficient for this boat.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Edited July 11, 2016 by Guest123456789

[Welster]

I sent PM. It may help?

[Foghorn]

I had the option of putting a 30HP 4 stroke on my boat, but for similar weight I put a Tohatsu 50HP 2 stroke, best decision I made, there is no way I would put a 40HP 4 stroke on the back as a lot of outboards had the same frame in the 40 to 50 range.

Hope this helps.

[Fab1]

A 30hp 2 stroke will be plenty for both those boats.

If going 4 stroke I'd go the 40hp.

Its entirely up to you of course.

My quinny 420 estuary angler handles everything I've thrown at it in the estuaries and bays running a 30hp yammy 2 stroke which is basically a busta in the runabout configuration with 3 of us on board and a rear seat full of gear.

It's great through chop and we have never been wet yet.

It doesn't have the free board you get in a open boat like the Busta due to the floor but we have never felt unsafe in the bays and estuaries.

It's rated for a 40hp the same as the busta.

Having said that the more hp the less they have to work harder.

Bear in mind that a 4 stroke will cost you more to service if you haven't already .

[brett985]

I had a 429 rampage with a yamaha cv30. Plenty of power. I towed tubes, fished, cruzed. But yeah it was thirsty and noisy and was a shit to start most of the time. Surely a 40hp 4 banger with the right prop would be adequate. Or go for an etec 30hp? Maintenamce on a 2stroke is dead simple and cheap. 4 stroke a bit more in depth for the average dude. My boat was stable as can be and i would carry 4 fat dudes no probs with 30hp of two stroke fury.

[antonywardle]

HI

there is a video on both of the engines that you are looking at here on a 420 renegade tinny.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhM6Jxxxnys

He is a dealer so take your salt with it. They don't comment on the weight, but were impressed with the 40 4-stroke

I'm an ETEC fan myself. I find it is quiet and not very smelly I have a 2010 90HP

Here they put an ETEC up against some 4-strokes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZvIw83uZgY

If you want to go fast with a smaller fuel bill, go ETEC ;-)

[Guest Guest123456789]

I had the option of putting a 30HP 4 stroke on my boat, but for similar weight I put a Tohatsu 50HP 2 stroke, best decision I made, there is no way I would put a 40HP 4 stroke on the back as a lot of outboards had the same frame in the 40 to 50 range.

Hope this helps.

Thanks mate, my boat I think is a lot smaller than yours.

A 30hp 2 stroke will be plenty for both those boats.

If going 4 stroke I'd go the 40hp.

Its entirely up to you of course.

My quinny 420 estuary angler handles everything I've thrown at it in the estuaries and bays running a 30hp yammy 2 stroke which is basically a busta in the runabout configuration with 3 of us on board and a rear seat full of gear.

It's great through chop and we have never been wet yet.

It doesn't have the free board you get in a open boat like the Busta due to the floor but we have never felt unsafe in the bays and estuaries.

It's rated for a 40hp the same as the busta.

Having said that the more hp the less they have to work harder.

Bear in mind that a 4 stroke will cost you more to service if you haven't already .

Thanks so much Fab this is a great comparison. Our boats are roughly the same weight and your engine very similar. Great to hear it works for you and also under load. Really appreciate your help!

I had a 429 rampage with a yamaha cv30. Plenty of power. I towed tubes, fished, cruzed. But yeah it was thirsty and noisy and was a shit to start most of the time. Surely a 40hp 4 banger with the right prop would be adequate. Or go for an etec 30hp? Maintenamce on a 2stroke is dead simple and cheap. 4 stroke a bit more in depth for the average dude. My boat was stable as can be and i would carry 4 fat dudes no probs with 30hp of two stroke fury.

Brett thanks so much - was hoping to hear from someone who has used what I'm being proposed. I hear what you're saying around the etec from all reports they're a great engine and I would prefer that to a Suzuki 2 stroke. I asked the dealer about etec and he won't supply them. Reckon he got burned a few years back - you get that.

HI

there is a video on both of the engines that you are looking at here on a 420 renegade tinny.

He is a dealer so take your salt with it. They don't comment on the weight, but were impressed with the 40 4-stroke

I'm an ETEC fan myself. I find it is quiet and not very smelly I have a 2010 90HP

Here they put an ETEC up against some 4-strokes

If you want to go fast with a smaller fuel bill, go ETEC ;-)

Thanks Anthony, appreciate your help mate.

I'm sticking with the 30hp, thanks so much raiders for your awesome advice! I really want a 4 stroke 40hp or greater, think it's better to wait for the second boat in a few years time, probably the renegade or outlaw 460 with tiller steer, what a rig! It's bloody confusing buying a new boat for the first time, the options are endless and the information can be overwhelming at times. Thanks again!

[The Incredible Hull]

I've got a 2 stroke, if I could turn back time, I'd definitely get a 4 stroke.

I'm so sick of those 2 stroke fumes. I've developed into a more mature fisherman over the last couple of years, having a 2 stroke is fine when you're at anchor, but if you're constantly moving or drifting, the motor will be on all day and those 2 stroke fumes are just horrible. I'm sure a lot of people will agree with this.

[Guest Guest123456789]

Thanks Hull, next engine will be a 4 stroke. The fumes worries me so does long term hearing damage. Could always wear a mask and ear muffs! My mates would get a great kick out of that lol.

Um going to be limited to estuary and bay which means the outboard is just to go from spot to spot over smaller distances. The troll motor should reduce the fumes and noise issue the more I use it,

[tackleberry]

i have a 40HP honda on the back of my bluefin 4.2 and with me and my son it go's from a stand still to banging on the rev limiter in under 5 seconds

and thats at 54.5 kph it has a 13"p prop so i need a stainless or ally 14"p .

i am as happy as with the grunt of this thing .

Edited July 12, 2016 by tackleberry

[antonywardle]

If outboards weren't such a big expense then it would be ok to buy

one then swap it if you didn't like it. Its easy to worry about the decision

and if you made the right call and would the other one have been better.

For me, I like my ETEC, and the dealer I take it to does good work and I

think that if you can find someone who services your engine that you like then

go with them.

Good luck with your choice!

[The Incredible Hull]

Thanks Hull, next engine will be a 4 stroke. The fumes worries me so does long term hearing damage. Could always wear a mask and ear muffs! My mates would get a great kick out of that lol.

Um going to be limited to estuary and bay which means the outboard is just to go from spot to spot over smaller distances. The troll motor should reduce the fumes and noise issue the more I use it,

That reminds me, I'm yet to order a mask, esp during this cold winter. I believe they're called "buffs".

[Guest Guest123456789]

If outboards weren't such a big expense then it would be ok to buy

one then swap it if you didn't like it. Its easy to worry about the decision

and if you made the right call and would the other one have been better.

For me, I like my ETEC, and the dealer I take it to does good work and I

think that if you can find someone who services your engine that you like then

go with them.

Good luck with your choice!

Absolutely they're not cheap. Neither are Leccys! And im with you on the dealer thing, you need to find one you can trust and rely on. My dealer has been absolutely brilliant I have messed these guys around no end with changes, additions, subtractions, then additions etc and not once has he lost his cool and been totally accomodating. Tonnes of questions and explanations - the amount of work he has done for a comparatively small sale is crazy. Guess he is both a nice guy and also realises that this will be the first of many boat purchases for me. Hopefully his engineers are up tithe challenge, I've met a few of them I think they will be.

[antonywardle]

Noise and smoke on my old outboard out of the water was incredible.

120 DB according to my ipad. ETEC is in the 80's so they aren't really all that loud

these days.

[Guest Guest123456789]

Great idea Anthony I didn't know phone could measure that. I just googled decibels and it says 80 or higher can cause damage. I'm interested to see how loud it is with WOT. If it's 80 or higher in getting ear muffs. Rather look stupid and not damage my hearing forever.

[jeffb5.8]

85db for 8hrs is the safe threshold before hearing damage may occur.
So for a comparison you go to a nightclub or concert that is an average of 110db or a screaming baby can also be 120db. At that limit hearing damage may start after just 15mins exposure.

My 2 stroke lawnmower 8yrs old is about 105db at 2 meters, I wear ear plugs.

My 2016 115Etec when on the ear muffs in my driveway on idle is quieter than my lawn mower, but it is a deeper sound and is less annoying that a wiper snipper.

On the water it is way less noisy although louder than my mates Honda 4 stroke.

I don't notice a smell of 2 stroke or see a oil slick behind the boat like my old 2007 Mercury.

Edit:

Found this for interest

Edited July 20, 2016 by jeffb5.8

[harold]

we have a 30hp 4 stroke mercury on our dinghy and it will get the 3 of us on the plane as long as we sit along the water line. If 2 sit in the back there is no way no way it will get up. I should have bought a 40hp. Next time.

[antonywardle]

that was out of the water on the ear muffs!

Not tried it on the water, will have a go next time I'm out

Good graph about DB too Jeff

Edited July 20, 2016 by antonywardle

[tackleberry]

Great idea Anthony I didn't know phone could measure that. I just googled decibels and it says 80 or higher can cause damage. I'm interested to see how loud it is with WOT. If it's 80 or higher in getting ear muffs. Rather look stupid and not damage my hearing forever.

don't get a mercury 30hp 2 stroke (what i call black tohatsu) their 115db wot