GoingFishing Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Gday Raiders Just been learning up on the bobbin knot. So far i think ive got the braid component of the knot worked out. What i cant get my head wrapped around is the mono end. Iv seen one video where they melt the mono to create a "bulb" or "bell" end.....but in some of the videos they just cut the mono end off. How does the mono not just slip through all the braid and out the other end? Is the logic that the braid friction is that strong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masterfisho7 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoingFishing Posted January 25, 2019 Author Share Posted January 25, 2019 7 minutes ago, masterfisho7 said: Thanks....doesnt really answer my question !!! So burning the end is the only thing stopping the mono slipping through? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonD Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 31 minutes ago, GoingFishing said: Thanks....doesnt really answer my question !!! So burning the end is the only thing stopping the mono slipping through? Every wrap of the braid I see done under tension, which equates to around 40 tight wraps when I do mine. I have had the mono slip when using Berkeley fireline, which is very smooth but apart from that I've yet to ever have a problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big Neil Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 7 hours ago, GoingFishing said: Thanks....doesnt really answer my question !!! So burning the end is the only thing stopping the mono slipping through? I am not familiar with this knot but I would imagine that the braid actually "bites into" the mono under increasing tension, similar to how the FG knot works. What do you think? Cheers, bn 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickmarlin62 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Think i will stik to improved albright never had a prob an tie it in 30 seconds...bobbin knot seems like it would be fun tying in a moving boat when fish are bustin up round u..... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scratchie Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Hey Sam, what do you intend to use the knot for??? Snapper stick? Flatty Fishing? Etc!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonD Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 (edited) The pr is a very strong knot, I use it on all line class but I find it pretty tricky with lines of 6lb. I've never had one fail, so never had to do one outside of the house but wouldn't be keen on doing one while out fishing. If I did have a break off for some reason I would revert to another rod ready to go ( as mentioned never happened) or do an fg. Edited January 26, 2019 by JonD 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonD Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 1 hour ago, rickmarlin62 said: Think i will stik to improved albright never had a prob an tie it in 30 seconds...bobbin knot seems like it would be fun tying in a moving boat when fish are bustin up round u..... What do you target using the albright, the reason I ask is that I had someone on my boat that swore by them but after several failed on good sized kings he swore at them. In the end he ended up using my backup outfit. The chart above doesn't rate the Albright to highly, testing done by a major game fishing magazine under controlled calibrated equipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmk086 Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 where did that table come from JonD? 11 and 16 don't make much sense to me, 4 half hitches 58% but 3 to 5 half hatches 49% ? am I missing something here haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoingFishing Posted January 26, 2019 Author Share Posted January 26, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Scratchie said: Hey Sam, what do you intend to use the knot for??? Snapper stick? Flatty Fishing? Etc!!! Trying to tie 60 pound braid onto 130lb mono leader with no swivel. Essentially i want to run 20m of 130lb leader straight onto the braid mainline. Ps. Intended to be fishing for beakies Edited January 26, 2019 by GoingFishing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoingFishing Posted January 26, 2019 Author Share Posted January 26, 2019 3 hours ago, JonD said: The pr is a very strong knot, I use it on all line class but I find it pretty tricky with lines of 6lb. I've never had one fail, so never had to do one outside of the house but wouldn't be keen on doing one while out fishing. If I did have a break off for some reason I would revert to another rod ready to go ( as mentioned never happened) or do an fg. By all accounts all the research ive done everyone including the blokes at the tackle store swear that the bobbin knot is the strongest braid to mono knot around....the attached chart seems to corroborate that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoingFishing Posted January 26, 2019 Author Share Posted January 26, 2019 So to sunmarise....the bobbin knot if tied correctly relies on friction between the braid and mono leader.....no melting of mono end required but can be done as a precaution??? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickmarlin62 Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 I use improved albright from 6lb braib to 80lb never have fails sensible drag settings and u shouldnt be breaking any decent knots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big Neil Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 24 minutes ago, GoingFishing said: So to sunmarise....the bobbin knot if tied correctly relies on friction between the braid and mono leader.....no melting of mono end required but can be done as a precaution??? That's how I would see it. Anyone else? bn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmk086 Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, rickmarlin62 said: I use improved albright from 6lb braib to 80lb never have fails sensible drag settings and u shouldnt be breaking any decent knots its just clunky through the rod guides especially if casting. I used improved Albright growing up but once you use a stronger thinner knot like FG its hard to go back Edited January 26, 2019 by jmk086 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scratchie Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 2 hours ago, GoingFishing said: Trying to tie 60 pound braid onto 130lb mono leader with no swivel. Essentially i want to run 20m of 130lb leader straight onto the braid mainline. Fair enough! A few guys I fish with use that knot but not on heavy line like that. I must admit I’m with rick! I use an improved Albright and don’t seem to have any problems. Interesting table JonD!!! Everyone seems to have an opinion on which knots work best for certain things but the best knot is the one that holds. So learn the ones you want for your application and do them well. Cheers scratchie!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonD Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 5 hours ago, jmk086 said: where did that table come from JonD? 11 and 16 don't make much sense to me, 4 half hitches 58% but 3 to 5 half hatches 49% ? am I missing something here haha It was from a US leading saltwater game magazine, likewise didn't make sense of some of those twist figures and put it down as a possible typo. For me the pr knot has allowed me to drop down into much lighter line class on such fish as kings. You may of seen a few of my recent reports where I'm now using 2-4kg outfits on kings using soft plastics rather than heavy jigs on short parabolic rods. It's amazing how much force you can put on light lines with good knots that don't fail. My breaking point is always on the heavier mono leaders close to the hook or on the hook knot, which is either a JM chain knot or a double wrap version of the uni. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nolongeramember Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 7 hours ago, GoingFishing said: Trying to tie 60 pound braid onto 130lb mono leader with no swivel. Essentially i want to run 20m of 130lb leader straight onto the braid mainline. Ps. Intended to be fishing for beakies I use similar lines for big kings but use heavier braid. If it was me I would tie a Bimini twist then tie an improved version of an Albright with the double. Everyone has their own opinions and tying styles. I wouldn’t take that table as gospel. You can bet every magazine and person would have their own unique table list order. My advice, take the time to properly test knots for yourself and use what works for you. When you see results, you will be glad you took the time to do it. Sometimes you only get one chance at a fish. I have proven to myself many times that time testing knots at home equals more trophy fish on the water. Anyone that says they have never had a failure on ANY knot are kidding themselves. It happens to the best. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingie chaser Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 20 hours ago, JonD said: The pr is a very strong knot, I use it on all line class but I find it pretty tricky with lines of 6lb. I've never had one fail, so never had to do one outside of the house but wouldn't be keen on doing one while out fishing. If I did have a break off for some reason I would revert to another rod ready to go ( as mentioned never happened) or do an fg. How were these tests carried out? I have seen a physical test(all be it crude) that the breaking stains of some of these knots were way higher. The FG was actually measured at %110 of line strength & actually the braid failed not the knot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickmarlin62 Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 Even the smallest thing like not lubricating the knot before tightening will make them fail....ive used spider hitches spinning off the rocks for years they say there rated at 80% ive never put 16 lbs of pressure on my 20lb line so i havnt had failures.......i dont see howsomething like a knot can be rated at 110% i didnt think u could go higher than 100 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingie chaser Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 Not a scientific test but probably a more true to life scenario testing I actually miss quoted, they rate the FG at %105. The whole thing is interesting to watch but the FG footage starts at 11.10mins 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonD Posted January 26, 2019 Share Posted January 26, 2019 2 hours ago, kingie chaser said: How were these tests carried out? I have seen a physical test(all be it crude) that the breaking stains of some of these knots were way higher. The FG was actually measured at %110 of line strength & actually the braid failed not the knot! They use an industry calibrated scale which involves wrapping the line around rollers several times with none of the wraps overlapping each other, with the chosen knot in the middle between the rollers which are about 1m appart. The machine simply pulls until the line breaks. Paulusfishing here in Aus used to do all this testing on lines and knots using fully calibrated machinery too but unfortunately his site has now closed. The comment stating those who haven't had a knot fail are kidding themselves is simply not true, I have never had a pr knot fail, it's always been the mono leader that has broken. I did mention how fireline had slipped but this never failed on me fishing as I simply never used that line after trying to do pr knots with it at home which didn't hold. When I use the pr on beach gear the smooth join allows weed to slip over it without bunching up, it also casts through the guides silky smooth. It doesn't matter to me one bit what knots people use, the thread was about using bobbin to do what to me is a pr knot, I'm certainly not trying to get anyone to go out and do the same as they can be tricky to do properly at first. This is 20lb braid to 40lb mono on one of my heavier outfits, I also use this join on my 150lb deep drop braid to 200lb mono, right down to 6lb. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmk086 Posted January 27, 2019 Share Posted January 27, 2019 I agree with kingi chaser I have so many doubts about that chart from my own physical testing.. fg is a lot stronger knot than they reckon.. and it wouldn't matter how many half hitches were tied at the end 4 or 6 or 10 the knot strength doesn't change with the same amount of twists. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingie chaser Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) I don't discount the effectiveness of the PR knot, I just thought some of those figures on the chart just didn't look right. Anyway I've never used it but it looks like its along the same principals as the FG knot. I just got a bobbin so I am willing to give it a go BUT with a lot of these type of rigs I tend to have these ready to go before setting foot in the boat & you have to be able to revert back to tieable knots you can at do at sea if something goes wrong. So for me that's why its good to have quite a few knots in the repertoire. If I lost my FG rig while out fishing & it was rocky I would probably go straight to a bimini double & Albright as & can do those in no time & in most conditions. I usually also carry some pre made wind on leaders as well so I done even have to worry about tying an Albright. Edited January 28, 2019 by kingie chaser 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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