Help with buying old fibreglass boat thats been fully restored

[intensehotdog]

Hi all,

I am looking at a 1971 Caribbean Crestcutter that has undergone a full restoration, new transom, stringers, floor and hull strengthened. The interior hull was rebuilt with 2 new layers of fibreglass, underfloor filled with foam and fully sealed. It also comes with a 2022 yamaha F90 4 stroke with 30 hours. 

Is this a risky purchase and what would you pay for it? Thanks!!

 

[noelm]

It’s a yes/no, it depends entirely on how the work was done. Lots of boats are “rebuilt” and are just patched up……no idea on this one, but I personally would want verifiable documentation on what was done, and who did it, and what warranty is offered. Price is anyone’s guess, it’s a decades old boat,(50+ years) nothing can change that, is the trailer good or patched up? The motor “should” be OK, but once again, it’s a second hand motor, you do your checks, you pay your cash and hope……

edit……I don’t know this boat or seller, but my motto….never believe anything the seller says that is not verifiable.

Edited August 29 by noelm
Typo

[clutch]

One would think that pictures would be taken throughout the process. Ask for them

[intensehotdog]

44 minutes ago, noelm said:

It’s a yes/no, it depends entirely on how the work was done. Lots of boats are “rebuilt” and are just patched up……no idea on this one, but I personally would want verifiable documentation on what was done, and who did it, and what warranty is offered. Price is anyone’s guess, it’s a decades old boat,(50+ years) nothing can change that, is the trailer good or patched up? The motor “should” be OK, but once again, it’s a second hand motor, you do your checks, you pay your cash and hope……

edit……I don’t know this boat or seller, but my motto….never believe anything the seller says that is not verifiable.

It was done by the seller  himself with all photos of the process. The trailer is good, but like you said im just unsure and its a long drive to inspect it.

[slowjigger]

Has he done restorations before? I wonder why he is selling it after doing all that work, or does he do up boats as a business or sideline? I'd be asking a few questions about the type of wood or composite used, type of fiberglass cloth, type of foam etc. Some materials are better than others and it might give you an idea as to his expertise.  

PS: the lower the price the less the risk, obviously. Has he put a price on it?

[noelm]

44 minutes ago, slowjigger said:

Has he done restorations before? I wonder why he is selling it after doing all that work, or does he do up boats as a business or sideline? I'd be asking a few questions about the type of wood or composite used, type of fiberglass cloth, type of foam etc. Some materials are better than others and it might give you an idea as to his expertise.  

PS: the lower the price the less the risk, obviously. Has he put a price on it?

It would be impossible to rebuild an old boat completely to make money…..unless it was done “backyard” style and no labour was counted.

[slowjigger]

5 minutes ago, noelm said:

It would be impossible to rebuild an old boat completely to make money…..unless it was done “backyard” style and no labour was counted.

 I said as a sideline - which would mean backyard style.

[intensehotdog]

He done the rebuild in 2009 and kept it ever since, now he says he hes injured and cant take it out. price is $11k and other details its a 5.3m, nice sounder, live bait tank, inbuilt esky. 

[slowjigger]

11 minutes ago, intensehotdog said:

He done the rebuild in 2009 and kept it ever since, now he says he hes injured and cant take it out. price is $11k and other details its a 5.3m, nice sounder, live bait tank, inbuilt esky. 

Sounds like a very good deal if he has done a decent job on the rebuild. 

[frankS]

The motor and trailer would almost be worth the price IF it all checks out being OK.

If you like the boat and don't mind driving such and old vessel and you have the dollars, I would say have a go but tread carefully as there would be NO sort of warranty with 2nd hand private seller.

A lot would depend on any documentation the seller has and series of photo's during the build process, ask lots of questions about his capabilities with handling the materials used. It might be embarrassing asking certain questions but it's your money at stake.

Frank

PS Old Carriibbeans and Bertrams were very strong boats

Edited August 29 by frankS

[intensehotdog]

Thanks for all your replies, hes sold it already first day listed. no problem another will come my way.

[slowjigger]

13 hours ago, noelm said:

It would be impossible to rebuild an old boat completely to make money…..unless it was done “backyard” style and no labour was counted.

Oh, and it happens sometimes, though it's usually to order (someone wanting their boat rebuilt). 

[JonD]

Doing fibreglass work at home seems to be quite a thing these days, personally I wouldn't touch doing it myself, even though I did two years of boatbuilding at Tafe. People that do it for a living understand so much in terms of resin mixes, working temps and will have insurance against defects. Develop an issue from a backyard build and insurance get wind of a non professional rebuild and you could be up against things a bit. I know of a young local lad who had his transom rebuilt by a local surfboard maker, so someone at least with an understanding of modern glass and resins. First run offshore to the shelf he split the transom down both sides and was lucky to get back home with it. He then got the same fella to repair it and then sold it on marketplace. Another local friend had similar issues on a boat he purchased which he wasn't aware had been rebuilt, which again developed issues at the transom and keel line. His insurance knocked him back when problems soon developed after purchase and the boat has been sitting in his garage for around 10yrs now simply taking up space (seafarer). 

Not saying the same will happen to you, it may well be a first class build that lasts years. Have you given any of the major boat insurance groups a call to ask if you will be covered if an issue arrises from a back yard rebuild. You could also get a professional shipwright inspection, or ask the owner to get one done. 

Though its sold, its something to consider, you may think you missed a bargain but you may of dodged a bullet too.

Edited August 29 by JonD

[slowjigger]

Insurance is for theft and accidents. It's never going to cover repairs or manufacturing defects - that's what warranties are for. 

[JonD]

14 hours ago, slowjigger said:

Insurance is for theft and accidents. It's never going to cover repairs or manufacturing defects - that's what warranties are for. 

Insurance will refuse to pay out on poorly maintained vessels, especially if the claim arrises from a poorly constructed repair that ends badly. Just like your home insurance will reject claims from failures not carried out by trades people. 

[slowjigger]

1 hour ago, JonD said:

Insurance will refuse to pay out on poorly maintained vessels, especially if the claim arrises from a poorly constructed repair that ends badly. Just like your home insurance will reject claims from failures not carried out by trades people. 

They would have to have reason to suspect that the repair caused the accident (possible but not that likely with boats). And how far do you take it? There is little in the way of boat building standards - even new ones can be shoddy due to poor design or errors. Normally you use the warranty for those situations. PS: I have made several claims on old boats - the insurer just paid up with no questions asked. 

Edited August 30 by slowjigger

[BaitDropper]

Buying that sort of era fiber glass boat will put you in the dilemma, that it has probably already been rebuilt, if not, chances are it will end up needing one.

I had mine inspected by a shipwright,( 1987 model) had a mate come with me to check it out, had 2 good hard sea trials, but it needed a full rebuild less than 5 years after I purchased it.

Either buy new, ( which isn't possible for most) or do your due diligence, if it's been rebuilt, ask for photo's, definitely get a professional inspection, take someone that has some experience with you for the initial inspection and sea trial. Don't be put off, if that boat you looked at is the era you are looking to purchase, expect a rotten transom or a past rebuild, it's just a fact of life. I certainly wouldn't be put off as long as you do your due diligence, I would say there are more boats of that era that have gone through rebuilds than those that have not, and still be sea worthy, thinking otherwise, would be foolish. Not everyone just patches there boats up with shoddy jobs, Yes, they are out there, but with help these can be identified or at least eliminated.

It'd be nice to throw the cash at a nice shiny new rig, but most aren't in a position to do that, so we go for the older rigs and inevitably end up going through the rebuild process.

By the sounds, at 11k, with that motor and trailer condition, and a named brand, it might have been a good buy, never know, just go in with eyes wide open..

Goodluck

[Hoods]

It costs money to Learn the old fulla used to tell me.

I'm glad I missed out on the first 3 "perfect" boats I fell in love with.

The more you look the more you learn. Then when the good boat & good deal come along you don't stuff around as you have done your homework.

I noticed the Build Plate in the photo - limited to 140hp. Any motor greater than that is a dead giveaway and any Insurance will be voided as it exceeds capacity. Looked at lots of boats like that!!

Good luck in your search

[frankS]

12 hours ago, Hoods said:

It costs money to Learn the old fulla used to tell me.

I'm glad I missed out on the first 3 "perfect" boats I fell in love with.

The more you look the more you learn. Then when the good boat & good deal come along you don't stuff around as you have done your homework.

I noticed the Build Plate in the photo - limited to 140hp. Any motor greater than that is a dead giveaway and any Insurance will be voided as it exceeds capacity. Looked at lots of boats like that!!

Good luck in your search

Hoods. I posted that photo simply to point out that Caribbeans and Bertram's were built by the same company, and everyone loves Bertram's.

The plate is not from the boat mentioned in this thread.

Frank