big_steve Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 hey fellas, just a quick post to see wat u guys reccommend as for a reel for the bock bone... thanks in advanced steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnno Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 (edited) What fish will you be targeting with it my sugestion is a Shimano (removed as to be unsuitable) or a Tiagra Edited November 23, 2006 by johnno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy0884 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 TLDII50 mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Reely Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I disagree. TLD 25 to 30, Tiagra 30LRS or TLD 50 running 15kg line and possibly 24kg line but using it as 15kg.. Rods are actually underrated, so a 24kg stick is more like a 15kg stick. You can run 24kg off it also but i would not as it would kill the rod quicker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Reely Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 yes my friend i would. All game fishos know thats how game rods and all rods nearly,are made. Not up to the specs. Why would it be any different in the feel, when you are trolling the extra strength of the rod is never gonna matter, never gonna alter the action of nothing! But gives you the extra strength in knowing you wont break it. I would go 37kg rod and run 15kg off it! But like you said, each to their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy0884 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I disagree.TLD 25 to 30, Tiagra 30LRS or TLD 50 running 15kg line and possibly 24kg line but using it as 15kg.. Rods are actually underrated, so a 24kg stick is more like a 15kg stick. You can run 24kg off it also but i would not as it would kill the rod quicker. Hi Reely, i take it from the above comments that you have a full arsenal of these rods and reels? as it happens i do, and the 15 kg stick is perfectly suited to run 15kg, and even funnier, the 24kg rod works profoundly well when running 24kg line class... the concept behind rating rods to a line class is that they have a full working curve when drag starts to peel from the reel with the apropriate line, for example, the 15kg rod has a full working curve with 5kg of drag coming off the reel, likewise for the 24kg rod with 8kg of drag. Running 5kg of drag over the 24kg stick barely loads it. Here's a little insight, anyone who puts a Tiagra of any sort on a backbone game rod is fooling themselves... The numbers on the rods and reels correspond with the line class they are to be used with... i.e: a TLD30 is a 15kg or 30lb reel, a TLD 50 is a 24kg or 50lb reel, designed for use with those line classes...the reason being is that they are able to apply the correct amount of drag and hold an apropriate amount of line on the spool (700m of 15kg on a TLD30 and 700m of 24kg on a TLD or Tiagra50) The Tiagra 30WLRS is a reel designed to be fished one line class up, 50lb... You are wasting your time running 350m of 24kg line on a TLD25 and only fishing it as you would 15kg... get onto a big beakie or YFT and watch it spool you clean before you know what has happened.. As for running 15kg line on 24kg gear, go for it, you have the advantage of more line capacity, but why go elephant hunting with a pea shooter, use an elephant gun re: killing the rod quicker.... again not true, the only way to kill a rod is to break it in two... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Reely Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 no worries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnno Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 tyrnos 30 is dwarfed by a 24kg rod and you shouldnt run 24kg on a 30, you wont get the correct load and action out of the rod from 15kg. CFD CFD I stand corrected tyrnos is no way suitable for a 24kg stick it has been removed drag to light on that reel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy0884 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 CFD I stand corrected tyrnos is no way suitable for a 24kg stick it has been removed drag to light on that reel Mate, you are not at fault, we are all on here to learn, i am learing things from fishraider every day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namesay Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 How about when you start to use braid? I think braid changes a few parameters like line capacity and the fact that this stuff breaks way above its stated strength and the zero stretch. What do you guys use? I love the shimano T curve rods as they fish a "range"of line classes but are great at the upper end of their specs also graphite so stiff for their diameter. Reels like the Shimano stella, Torsa and Daiwa saltiga can really fish braid to max. CHeers Kelvin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy0884 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Braid is another discussion all together kelvin, and a good point to bring up.... Braid will definately allow you to run one or two smaller class reels, but it demands an upgrade in other areas, braid users will need to ensure their reels are capable of pushing out massive drag pressures, usually starting at 10kg at strike, something the cloth drag single speed TLD's will struggle with, also, braid would be a nightmare to use on a fully rollered backbone as the roller guides simply do not have the quality to prevent the braid getting between the roller and the frame, a better option for braid users would be the non rollered Tcurve jig sticks that run silicon guides or the T curve game rods that run aftco rollers which are built to significantly tighter tolerances. Another point for the braid users, as Kelvin mentioned, there is no stretch, so a softer rod will give more shock absorbtion and lead to less kooks being pulled, it is also friendlier on the angler. I use the T-curves on all of my braid outfits with great results, they can fish a wide range of line classes for their design, and the t curve blanks give a 2 stage working curve depending on how heavy the rod is loaded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
netic Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 Steve, are you talking about the rod that came with the tyrnos, If so im sure thats a 15kg Backbone I dont look too much into the line classes etc I grab a strong rod, Whack a strong reel on it with heavy ass line and fish away, has always worked for me, dont get too many bust offs........( last weeks bust offs werent on my gear) What do you want to use the 24kg for???? thats the most important thing.... If you wanna target some game fish with it, say YFT etc i would recommend the tld 2 speed as mentioned spooled with 24kg line......Be overgunned and never be undergunned i say... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namesay Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 (edited) Braid is another discussion all together kelvin, and a good point to bring up.... Braid will definately allow you to run one or two smaller class reels, but it demands an upgrade in other areas, braid users will need to ensure their reels are capable of pushing out massive drag pressures, usually starting at 10kg at strike, something the cloth drag single speed TLD's will struggle with, also, braid would be a nightmare to use on a fully rollered backbone as the roller guides simply do not have the quality to prevent the braid getting between the roller and the frame, a better option for braid users would be the non rollered Tcurve jig sticks that run silicon guides or the T curve game rods that run aftco rollers which are built to significantly tighter tolerances. Another point for the braid users, as Kelvin mentioned, there is no stretch, so a softer rod will give more shock absorbtion and lead to less kooks being pulled, it is also friendlier on the angler. I use the T-curves on all of my braid outfits with great results, they can fish a wide range of line classes for their design, and the t curve blanks give a 2 stage working curve depending on how heavy the rod is loaded. I totally agree with most roller runners being made to poor tolerances. The braid will find its way into the gaps in no time....BIG bust off time! Also agree with T curves. Sensational for braid. THe SIC guides are FANTASTIC. very little heat generation. As I am typing this I have a Shimano Torsa in my hands.....can't get my hands off it really. ALmost as good as sex... let me correct that ...it is better than sex as it lasts !!! Great to have a reel designed for braid from day one. Sensational bit of gear! I use about 3-5 meters of mono leader most of the time to counter the lack of shock absorption. ALso going down one line class in the rod is a good idea most of the time with braid. Now days it seems most of my reels are filled with this stuff. Perfect for kings!CHeers KElvin Edited November 24, 2006 by namesay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FletcherG1991 Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 the only thing with braid is that it's not IGFA rated so if your looking for records or get a record fish or whatever you will have so problems you also have more chance of pulling the hooks on fish anyway thats just my 2 cents oh and the TLD 50 2 speed would be perfect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TunOFun Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 Here's a little insight, anyone who puts a Tiagra of any sort on a backbone game rod is fooling themselves... Please explain... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy0884 Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 Please explain... Its like putting $50 tyres on a BMW.... Its silly to buy a Tigara for $900 and put it on a $100 rod, there is nothing at all wrong with the backbone rods, i have a bunch of them with TLD's on them.. but if i was going to buy a tiagra, i'd buy a T-curve stroker to suit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namesay Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 In the area of fishing tackle you REALLY DO get what you pay for. I enjoy my fishing so much more when I have good equipment in my hands. Sure it costs $$$$ but it is the finer things in life that makes it better. The extra confidence you have with good gear is something you cannot understand until you experience it for yourself. Matching a Tiagra or a Torsa to a backbone is like having a diamond mounted on el cheapo sterling silver!!! The extra stiffness, the mechanical integrity, the better drags, the smoother actions..etc are all engineered to make your day so much better. Rods, reels, lines , hooks they all come into the equation. Over the long term the better equipment costs you less. I bought a whole lot of cheaper OKUMA reels....completely wasted a lot of $$. CHeers Kelvin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dezmo Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 I can see some merit to the arguement about running a rod a line class up in certain circumstances. I think it is worth thinking about, when you want to fish the line class to the limits. For example I have some 24 kg outfits (one of which is a backbone) I run with TLD 25's with 30lb and 40lb line for kings etc. With this type of fishing, you tend to head for sunset (with thumbs as well) to prevent kings getting to the reef. When doing this its nice knowing the rod has the balls to handle it. However in the main, I agree with the line class matching the rod. When trolling and fishing normal drag settings (ie 5kg) the 24kg rod does not feel great and i wish i had something softer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namesay Posted November 30, 2006 Share Posted November 30, 2006 (edited) I can see some merit to the arguement about running a rod a line class up in certain circumstances. I think it is worth thinking about, when you want to fish the line class to the limits. For example I have some 24 kg outfits (one of which is a backbone) I run with TLD 25's with 30lb and 40lb line for kings etc. With this type of fishing, you tend to head for sunset (with thumbs as well) to prevent kings getting to the reef. When doing this its nice knowing the rod has the balls to handle it. However in the main, I agree with the line class matching the rod. When trolling and fishing normal drag settings (ie 5kg) the 24kg rod does not feel great and i wish i had something softer. When it comes to fishing for kings, a "standard" game rod is not always the most suitable piece of equipment. Lately we are getting some seriously good gear from Japan which is perfectly designed for the seriola clan. Most game rods are designed for fish like marlin and tuna which take large amounts of line but fight clean. The reason that most game rods have their drags set at 1/3 is to account for the increase in drag as the line peels off the spool. As the diameter of line left in your spool diminishes the drag increases proportionally. SO with half the diameter, your drag will increase by100%. As an example your 5kg drag at full spool is now 10kg at half spool. With all this line in the water, water pressure will also become extremely important so 1/3 at strike is the norm. For most game fishers it is recommended to loosen the drag as more line is peeled off. I still remember when I was younger and doing some LBG. This is where massive amounts of line can be in the water and if the drag isn't backed off, you lose the fish big time. With kings on the other hand, the fight is mostly vertical. It is balls out in the first few minutes and locked drags are the norm. THe reverse drag setting should be used for kings compared to normal game fishing! You start with high drag and slowly back it off as the fish comes closer to the boat!!! Typically I set the drag at 50% at strike and often go to sunset which is 100% and back it off as the fish nears the boat. With rods, your choice is to either go for the newer jig style rods with a slower taper or go for something with a faster/multi taper with a lock up point. With the multi taper rods you can easily fish higher or lower line classes than what is rated. These rods tend to be very versatile - a jack of all trades. But the specialist jig/popper style rods coming from our Japanese friends is changing everything I know about rod technology. They are light, have no real lock up points , are graphite and do the job amazingly well. They can fish several line classes as well. These rods are especially designed for braid. They tend to feel a bit soft but that is deceptive and is well suited to cushion the lunges of a fish with zero stretch braid. They cost a bit but quality costs. I find that they are a little too effective!!! The kings are stopped a little too easy. The pressure they can exert is enormous to the fish but very little on the angler. But that is where the technology is heading. I have been watching Dennis Braid when fishing for Bluefin on stand up tackle.....BOY he really is going to change things in the future!!!Cheers Kelvin Edited November 30, 2006 by namesay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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