beach rig Q's - check my rig?

[user1829]

n00b with a 12ft Silstar and Penn 560L going to beach for early morning session,

my first time with this gear on the beach and first time using live baits for big fish (maybe Jewies),

main line on the Penn is 300yards of 20lb Fins PRT braid, attached via albright knot to yo-zuri 20lb fluorocarbon shock leader of about 15ft..

i will terminate the shock leader with ball bearing swivel and an 'ezi-rig' attached to a 3 or 4oz star or snapper sinker (depends on the swell action)

from the swivel i will run abt 50cm of 50lb fluoro leader to a snelled pair of 8/0 Gamakatsu Octopus hooks (or size 5/0 depending on bait we catch)

questions:

1. is the 20lb main - 20lb shock - 50lb trace line ratings OK/too small?
   
2. if i have had a few of my albrights fail, is there a more reliable knot to join the main braid to the shock leader?
   
3. is the running ez-rig sinker the best option? or a paternoster maybe?
   
4. is 50cm leader enough/too much?
   
5. are the 8/0's too big for 15cm livies? (proble herring/yakka's)
   
6. are the octopus hooks the best, or live bait circle hooks better?
   
7. do lumo beads make any difference? where would they go?
   

thanks for any feedback on this proposed rig & set-up!

[SCOTTYB]

[*]is the 20lb main - 20lb shock - 50lb trace line ratings OK/too small?

[*]if i have had a few of my albrights fail, is there a more reliable knot to join the main braid to the shock leader?

[*]is the running ez-rig sinker the best option? or a paternoster maybe?

[*]is 50cm leader enough/too much?

My 2c worth:

I would run 30lb main straight to the trace - sometimes up to 60lb depending on where we are, but not less than 30lb

Why/how are your albrights failing - I've never had one fail, although take my time tying and check, recheck. Perhaps explain how you are tying and how they fail and we can help you here. Albright should be fine.

I used to use ez rig, but found it would tangle with braid. Now use a small swivel with a 8-10inch dropper to the sinker (light line so if snagged you only lose the sinker)then a bead before the swivel to the trace (hope that makes sense)

50 - 80 cm trace in my experience is good

SB

[cmhcfish]

* is the 20lb main - 20lb shock - 50lb trace line ratings OK/too small?

* if i have had a few of my albrights fail, is there a more reliable knot to join the main braid to the shock leader?

* is the running ez-rig sinker the best option? or a paternoster maybe?

* is 50cm leader enough/too much?

* are the 8/0's too big for 15cm livies? (proble herring/yakka's)

* are the octopus hooks the best, or live bait circle hooks better?

* do lumo beads make any difference? where would they go?

1) You can go higher on the shock leader, general rule of thumb 10lb per 1oz of sinker you are casting

2) I don't rate albrights at all after having them slip (maybe I was doing them wrong). I initially started on them but soon switched to a slim beauty knot after a couple sessions. Slim beauty seems a lot stronger and is not too hard to tie. As an added bonus it's a bit more profiled and should cast easier compared to an albright. Afterwards I suggest learning FG knot. Harder to learn and master but seems a lot more secure and even thinner. Hint - try keeping the knot just outside the reel if you have problems casting.

3) Ez rig/paternoster works depending on conditions. Your live bait is gonna be quite big so you won't need too heavy of a sinker (you want it to swim around a bit).

4) 8/0 fine for targetting jews - even soapies have vacuum cleaner mouths... If you use double hooks you can probably drop to a pair of snelled 6/0's as sometimes the larger hooks stop the bait for swimming well

5) Personal preference, I think circles work better for 1 hook rigs though

6) For live bait I don't think the lumo beads make too much difference. For dead baits/night fishing I think they might. Otherwise that's why those "snapper snatcher" type rigs with lumo beads and sparkly tassles wouldn't be so popular. It's just added attractant.

[user1829]

* is the 20lb main - 20lb shock - 50lb trace line ratings OK/too small?

* if i have had a few of my albrights fail, is there a more reliable knot to join the main braid to the shock leader?

* is the running ez-rig sinker the best option? or a paternoster maybe?

* is 50cm leader enough/too much?

* are the 8/0's too big for 15cm livies? (proble herring/yakka's)

* are the octopus hooks the best, or live bait circle hooks better?

* do lumo beads make any difference? where would they go?

1) You can go higher on the shock leader, general rule of thumb 10lb per 1oz of sinker you are casting

2) I don't rate albrights at all after having them slip (maybe I was doing them wrong). I initially started on them but soon switched to a slim beauty knot after a couple sessions. Slim beauty seems a lot stronger and is not too hard to tie. As an added bonus it's a bit more profiled and should cast easier compared to an albright. Afterwards I suggest learning FG knot. Harder to learn and master but seems a lot more secure and even thinner. Hint - try keeping the knot just outside the reel if you have problems casting.

3) Ez rig/paternoster works depending on conditions. Your live bait is gonna be quite big so you won't need too heavy of a sinker (you want it to swim around a bit).

4) 8/0 fine for targetting jews - even soapies have vacuum cleaner mouths... If you use double hooks you can probably drop to a pair of snelled 6/0's as sometimes the larger hooks stop the bait for swimming well

5) Personal preference, I think circles work better for 1 hook rigs though

6) For live bait I don't think the lumo beads make too much difference. For dead baits/night fishing I think they might. Otherwise that's why those "snapper snatcher" type rigs with lumo beads and sparkly tassles wouldn't be so popular. It's just added attractant.

thnaks both,

RIG: well we went out and the ezi-rig was tangled a few more times compared to my mates paternoster rigs, but there was pretty heavy shore dump sets every 1-2 minutes, so tangles were inevitable...

next time i will try both 8-10in dropper line (sacrificial size, say 15lb?) from the ezi-rig and also a normal swivel based paternoster like SCOTTYB said...

HOOKS: the hooks i used were Mustard 8/0 'big reds' and 8/0 'hoodlems'

i liked the hoodlems as they are smaller and not offset, the tail stinger hook sat really nice in the skin of the yakkas we caught...

SHOCK LEADER: so if i was casting a 3oz star sinker - the shock leader should be 30lbs? or do you count the sinker weight + the bait weight when determining shock leader size?

ALBRIGHTS: and my albrights didnt fail this time either! no problems casting - but you can hear the knot hitting the guides...

but regardless, i will try to persevere with leaning the slim beauty or FG - in the comfort of the lounge room!

RESULTS: nothing was biting (totally nothing), so after 3 hours of watching beautiful sunrise we went back to our rail bridge spot and hooked into some 35+ breams!

Edited April 9, 2012 by user1829

[SCOTTYB]

thnaks both,

RIG: well we went out and the ezi-rig was tangled a few more times compared to my mates paternoster rigs, but there was pretty heavy shore dump sets every 1-2 minutes, so tangles were inevitable...

next time i will try both 8-10in dropper line (sacrificial size, say 15lb?) from the ezi-rig and also a normal swivel based paternoster like SCOTTYB said...

ALBRIGHTS: and my albrights didnt fail this time either! no problems casting - but you can hear the knot hitting the guides...

Mate, no worries - nice to see some feedback on the suggestions.

To clarify what I meant about the dropper for the sinker, instead of using an ezy rig, I use a small swivel in place of the ezrig, with a light dropper tied off that to the sinker. Not sure if this will make sense, but my rig will be [mainline with running swivel + dropper to sinker]---[bead (doesn't have to be lumo, just stops the running swivel catching)] --- [swivel] --- [trace + hooks]

For the albright, I find doubling the braid and tying onto the shock leader or direct to trace (depending on setup) works well. As long as you are tying the albright with the braid, not with mono/fluoro and tie VERY tight you can get a very smooth profile. You should be able to trim the tag of the mono flush with the braid, tighten the braid again and the last wrap should tighten around the tag = next to nothing hitting the guides. Takes a bit of practice though - my brother showed me this after we had both been using normal albrights for ages and the first few times I just wasn't pulling everything tight enough. Slim beauty also works well, although have found this better with the braid doubled before tying also.

Nice work on the bream too, by the way.

SB

Edited April 10, 2012 by SCOTTYB