NaClH2OK9 Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 (edited) If you've caught any of my other posts you'll know im a noob with this boating game. I'm trying to fathom the handling of my new toy whilst watching all those around me ( including boat fulls of kids ( no prejudice infered) ) whistle past me without a care in the world and spinning their boats round like Barry sheen ( now I'm showing my age). Ok the situation. I've got an old 5.2 M alloy half cabin (with a 70hp motor) . Plenty big enough to put her on the plane. I'm aware of the importance of trim when being on the plane and have practiced this but on the whole I don't push the throttle that far as I have had a couple of scares. When traveling at anything above low speed I'm finding that the boat is really affected by even the smallest of waves or wakes from other boats. On more than one occasion I've found that I've been pulled or pushed to one side or another that I don't have the strength to fight through it and the boat almost nose dives jarring sharply over the more I fight it with the only solution being to back off the throttle and come to an almost stop. A couple of ideas come to mind 1. I'm driving it like an arse 2. There is something wrong with the boat design or setup. I've been reading up on things like chine walk and stern steer and this may just be a case of the boat being too down trim happy at rest and I need to bring her way up from rest for even low speed use but I clearly need some help getting to the bottom of this to enjoy my boat. Can anyone recommend a local engineer or boat driving instructor who can help me understand this. Or does it sound familiar to any of you? Thanks for reading this far. Steve Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Edited February 24, 2014 by Cluster13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dfishin Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 (edited) Steve. Sounds like your having some trouble handling your boat. Its hard to say what the cause of this could be but i will tell you my thoughts. The first thing that is worth saying is that all boats no matter how big or small will be effected by waves and the water and someone new to boating may be very suprised and maybe uncomfortable how much a wave or water can throw a boat around. The boat size to motor HP sounds fine so shouldnt be a problem there. Now when you say that the boat is being pushed or pulled to one side and at the same time going for a nose dive. This sounds to me that this is happening when you are in a following sea ie, Going in the same direction of the wave, Pushing through the back of a wave and down the face? Correct me if i am wrong. If this is the case then what your boat is doing is not too un common. This is the most dangerous/temperamental time while driving. A number of things could cause this to happen worse. It sounds like you do have the motor trimmed right down pushing the nose down. Try trimming up a little bit espeically in a folloing sea. Sounds like you might have the boat loaded front heavy which is strange as alot of us boat owners are trying to load front heavy to get the nose down. Your boat being an Alloy half cab would already be putting weight forward. Think about your load and try to even it out. If it is machenical steering try making sure that your cable is free and easy to turn. Motors are hard enough to turn under power and if the machincal steering cable starts to seize up they are hard to turn. What I am getting at here is that yes your boat might take a bit of a dive one way and it may feel nearly impossible for you to pull back, If your cable is partly seized and your fighting that as well. A free cable may allow you to pull her back straght. You can also now get an anti feed back Machenical Steering cable which stops the motors natural force to be pulling more one way. Have you noticed that it is easier to turn one way than the other. ? If so its not a drama as this is natural in an outbord boat but there are some things you can do to correct/minimise this effect. I hope this helps a little? Dave Edited February 24, 2014 by Dfishin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dfishin Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Just reading your post again. You say that that crossing the smallest of waves is causing pulling to one side and a diving effect. Being new to handling a boat and for anyone getting experience in a new boat that they are not familiar with. While crossing waves either head on or crosssing them from behind ( following sea ) always hit the wave straight head on, So cross the wave at as close to 90deg as possible in either direction wich is the safest way to cross a wave. Once you gain experince and get familiar with your boat you should become more comfortable how it will react. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batfishing Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Where abouts are you located Cluster Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 24, 2014 Author Share Posted February 24, 2014 Hi Dave and thanks for taking the time to reply. Just to clarify the nose dive statement. My kit goes flying everywhere and I believe I'd have sunk her on more than one occasion if I hadn't hit the emergency stop button. Ok. Yes on one occasion I was in a following sea and believe I may have been going a little quicker than the waves putting me in a position where I was coming down the face of a wave. That said I was trying to steer straight and it pulled me hard right so I ended up nearly side onto the wave by the time I hit stop. But I've also found this heading into a relatively flat sea and hit a 1foot wake from an overtaking (on my left) boat ( it wasn't that much bigger than me and I tried to steer into it) it pushed me so far to the right at main bar I got scared I'd run her aground. I. E. A good 30-50 M off course. I've also had this on open water where I've been trying to go north in bate Bay with waves heading obviously In shore. I attacked the waves at greater than 45 deg thinking I shouldn't take the parallel but how else do I get from left to right against an on comming sea. But thinking about it I was coming down the trailing edge of the wave when again it was like the boat decided to take a nose dive to the right before I hit stop. It's interesting what you say about the steering. I do think it's tight but I have nothing tho compare it with. When I have (nervously) had it up on the plane and trimmed ( trimmed up untill cavitation then down a couple of clicks) I've found it very heavy to steer which may well indicate buggered steering cables. I still feel I need an expert to take it out though. I'd rather pay someone an hour to test it than persevere for hours pushing my luck in something that feels dangerous. If they say it's fine and it's me I'm happy to get some 1 on 1 training. I've got decades of car and big bike experience. But I wouldn't hit a full on 4x4 course after reading a book. I've too much much respect for the sea to do the same even if others do make it look so easy. Cheers mate. Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 24, 2014 Author Share Posted February 24, 2014 Hi Ian. I'm in Cronulla Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batfishing Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 I'd be happy to offer to go for a run with you some time Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 24, 2014 Author Share Posted February 24, 2014 Weight. I've got around 50 liters of fuel in in tank at the transoms and all gear except my emergency box(life jackets. Torch. Flares. Ect. Ect) and tackle bag (not sinkers) is behind me. Oh and anchor up front. I'll keep these to the stern next time but at 30kg max don't think it's the issue. Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 24, 2014 Author Share Posted February 24, 2014 (edited) Thanks Ian. At your convenience. I work week days but can knock off early if you want to do an afternoon run. Any weekend is good too. Very grateful for the offer mate. Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Edited February 24, 2014 by Cluster13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chr42is Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 http://www.clubmarine.com.au/internet/clubmarine.nsf/docs/MG19-2+Technical Have a look at this ,might help Cheers chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Thanks chr42is I'll have a read and have book marked but suspect your message will be removed as we're not allowed external links in posts only in pms Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Chr42is. I've read a couple of articles on trim but that is by far the best. I'm almost convinced now that this is a broaching issue I have. It probably sounds stupid but I always assumed that the "starting" point was to be fully trimmed in then trim out on the plane. I think I'll leave the rods at home this weekend and just take her out for lots of practice. Cheers Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Quote Without out trim, the bows are more likely to bury and may veer uncontrollably to one side. This is known as broaching and it’s extremely dangerous. Broaching places the boat side on to the sea in a vulnerable position and the sudden change of direction when the broach occurs can be violent enough to throw the person at the wheel aside. Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dfishin Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Steve. Just to clarify. I hope you didnt take offence to my reply as i did not mean it to sound condacending in any way. It does sound like your boat is reacting dangerously from what you are describing. And yes your right a proffessional may be the way to go. Good luck and as you said its good to have a healthy respect for the sea. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juggs Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 is the hull bent or concaved from trailer damage ?just another thing to look at poorley set up trailers or thin alloy on rollers can reverse concave the bottom of the boat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 No worries Dave. All advice and opinion are gratefully received. Now if you'd said it's obviously option 1 that's the issue Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Hi juggs there is a little damage right at the front but this looks more from beaching than anything. I don't think it's big enough to change the dynamics but I'll be pointing at it when I get someone to give it the once over. TBH at this time I'm pretty convinced it's a mix of stiff steering. Cable and bad trim set up by me. Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batfishing Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Hi Cluster, Send me a pm with your number and I'll give you a call. It would most likely be on the weekend anyway. I have a boat in Buraneer Bay at the marina, so I'm down that way quite a bit on the weekends anyway. I currently run a 35'. However I started in a canoe, before they were popular, then a 12' punt, then a 15' nautiglass with a 55 hp for 17 years, followed by a 540 Signature with a 140 for 6 years. And I still mostly fish from a mates Scout center console. So I am fairly apt in a trailer boat Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) Thanks Ian PM sent Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Edited February 25, 2014 by Cluster13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paikea Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Hi Cluster I live at Cronulla and would be happy to have a look at the set up of your boat on the trailer late this afternoon or evening. Send me a PM with your Mobile No if you would like to do that and we can arrange time/place. Cheers Paikea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaClH2OK9 Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 Thanks Paikea. PM sent. Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paikea Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Turns out that Cluster lives less than 1 K from me so I am having a look at his boat for him this evening. Cheers Paikea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juggs Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 take a straight edge and look under the hull, either motor is off centre or the hull is bent mate has just had hi s5m centre console replaced after 3 months similar results and the hull was bent up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWV Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 take a straight edge and look under the hull, either motor is off centre or the hull is bent mate has just had hi s5m centre console replaced after 3 months similar results and the hull was bent up Be careful with using the level or straight edge on your hull. I am not saying it won't work but it may give you misleading information. Vessel are often designed with a slightly convex or concave though different sections of the hull. Some others even have wedges in the hull to correct an original design fault. The delta conic in the hull may also trick you into thinking sometime was out when it's exactly what it's meant to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rumz Posted February 26, 2014 Share Posted February 26, 2014 I know this may sound stupid but have you checked the drain plugs on the hull and made sure there is no water. Lift it right up on an angle as well. The way you described the boat drives happened to me when I test drove my boat , it was terrible. When we got back to the ramp I wanted to check if it takes on water , I swear we were standing there for a good 10mins watching all this water come out, there must of been 300L plus!!! The bloke tells me it was because he washed the boat with the plugs done up. Went back out when emptied and it was like driving a completely different boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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