How Can I Catch Some Drummer And Luderick?

[dani!o]

ok, i've been absent for quite some time, but alas my exams are not over!!! I'm just going crazy and i have to talk some fishing...

i met some dude on the bus the other day, said he was going to maroubra to catch luderick and drummer... he told me they taste delicious, and arent hard to catch at all on his cheapo rods... so i thought why am i on the beach trying to catch the ever illusive mahi mahi when i should be on the rocks eating sea salt flavoured drummer!!!

i got some tips off him, but ppls please let me know if this is right or not...

Rod - 2 m to 2.5 m, light

line - 12lb

bait - bread with a bit of seawater scrunched onto the hook (is this right? doesnt it just fall off?), cunjovi

hook - really small (can someone give me an approxite size)

and then, just with a small ball sinker (anyone recommend a size) stuck 20cm above the hook, and away you go...

and best time is at low tide...

does that sound about right ppls??

ok, now i gotta get back to study please oh no the suicide inclination is going up again ahhhhhhh.... if you guys wanna know how i feel, check this out!!

Edited November 10, 2007 by dani!o

[injay]

Yeh exam times sucks doesnt it! Jus did my finance 1 this morning and what better than to go fishing after to unwind.

bread, cabbage or stringy weed (collect on the rocks, the stuff growing on the surface, fresher the better)

is the go for blackfish.

each works well in different phases of the tide plus also pending on where your fishing

you can get blackfish hooks, their extra puny and green in colour

for drummer, live crabs and tiger prawns!

Generally the idea is you watch your float the whole day!

however both blackfish and drummer are great pound for pound fighters for their size!

ever land a big silver drummer and you will know why!

Just do a search of the site for 'blackfish' and you will find plenty of info.

Cheers Jin

[arpie]

Hi Danilo

Congrats on finishing your exams - now for the hard part ..... waiting for the results!!

Re blackie & drummer fishing - I am assuming you are talking off the rocks, here ...... shoot a pm off to Luderick59 - he has a wealth of knowledge on the subject!

They are great eating - some people rate drummer higher again than blackfish!

Cheerio

Roberta

PS check out this posting for some good 'starting' tips for estuary blackfishing - it'll be a start, anyway!

http://fishraider.com.au/Invision/index.ph...c=23679&hl=

[Mondo Rock]

Danilo - pm me and we'll arrange a drummer session at Maroubra over the next couple of weeks. It will need to be over a weekend as Drummer and Blackfishing is a daytime only event (and I work during the weekdays).

Your gear is fine and you won't need to buy anything else to fish for them. You will, however, need to start saving up as much stale or discarded bread as you can. The more the better - and preferably white. The key to drummer is burley, and the more bread the better.

I have a couple of spots I can show you that produce for me regularly.

We can also have a go at the blackies but they're a much more specialised target that will require gear that you don't have. Better to start with the drummer and them move up to blackies if you want.

Shoot me a message and we can arrange for a session.

[kenmare]

Hi Danilo,

Glad you've got your priorities right: fishing is just a pleasurable pastime (or should be), but exam results can affect the rest of your life.

As for blackfish, first decide where you're going to catch them, as there are big differences in both tackle and technique depending upon whether you intend to catch them off the ocean rocks or in the estuaries.

Assuming you intend to catch them off the ocean rocks at Maroubra, then you need a rod of at least 12' (3.5 to 4 metres) in length, to keep in contact with your float on long drifts and control fish in close. If you hope to land black drummer (pigs) on the rod, then it will need to be fairly robust in the butt, even if soft in the tip. When you hook your first good size pig you'll find out why.

Centre pin reels like the Avon Royal or the newer Shakespeare are traditional, although many fishos these days use the Alvey sidecast blackfish reel. The Alvey has the advantage of also combining well with a heavier ocean luderick rod for bream and other light rock and beach fishing.

Use about 9lb to 12 lb (4kg to 5 kg) main line, and lighter trace of 6lb to 8 lb (3kg to 4kg) that will break before your main line does -- this means that if you hook up on the bottom or get smashed by a pig at least you'll get your float back.

Smear vaseline on your line to make it float. Also use a proper fixed heavy blackfish float or bobby cork (so it won't be affected by wave action) and weight the line with a single large lead (ball sinker, lead shot, or sheet lead) about half a metre above the hook, rather than adding several weights up the line, to make the float less buoyant so bites can be easily detected.

And use smaller hooks (sneck or french are traditional but I find suicide also work well) in the #8 to #6 range unless specifically targeting pigs, in which case use #4 or larger.

Don't worry about burley, just scrape smaller bits of cabbage off the rocks with your cleats, or better still a cheap fish scaler (so you won't wear out your cleats), to bring the fish around. But don't scuff too much into a big wash or the fish will follow it away from where you're fishing.

For bait, select long but young leaves of cabbage (usually found in the crevices and rock pools), and ask some of the experienced locals to show you how to put it on the hook correctly.

While they're doing that also find out the best tides to catch blackfish(different spots work best at difference stages of the tide), and any reef over which you can drift your float: blackfish often congregate in big schools around reef outcrops. Catch the first one and you're well on your way to catching a bag full.

One of the secrets to catching blackfish off the rocks is to fish at the correct depth. Start fishing at about a rod length below your float, and vary the depth up or down until you find the depth at which the fish bite. If all you are catching are rock cales and pigs, then it usually means you are fishing too deep -- shorten up.

You should also be aware that when blackfish are "ringing" (spawning) on the surface in late autumn and winter you can still catch them, even though some people believe you can't. All you need to do is shorten-up to about a metre or even less under your float and the blackfish will usually still take your cabbage bait.

And always remember, safety first: always check-out the size and pattern of swells for danger before venturing onto the low luderick ledges, and try to fish with others in a group.

Hope some of this helps.

Regards,

Bob

Edited November 12, 2007 by kenmare

[Beaver]

Your gear sounds too light for big drummer. Sounds ok for luderick though.

I use a heavier beach rod (6-10kg) and 30LB mono for drummer. Sometimes my rod feels like it's going to break when i hook up 3kg drummer.

Peeled prawns and cunje are good for drummer.

Use bread to burley them up and use a 1/0 hook either under a float or just floating around in the wash.

[coastspinna]

hey danilo...

kenmare(bob) has offered you some excellent advice there...

there are 3 schools of thought i think when chasin drummer...i fish for them a lot like your mate does with a 7 foot rod and 9 lb or 12lb straight thru to the hook with the strongest small hooks you can find and the smallest sinker you can get away with.i hardly evr use floats because i use bread for bait and it gets hammered pretty quick.

secondly is bobs method of fishing heavy blackfishing gear which is highly effective...his point on using a lighter leader than mainline is great advice when pigs start stealin all your floats...but when big pigs are around i would up your mainline to 15 lb or more...

thirdly are blokes that fish for big tank drummer of 3kg or more...these guys use 14 ft alveys and big cunji baits or red rock crabs..30lb line or more are required and groper are usually a bycatch

i tend to fish the first way cause it is so much fun but when i get busted up too many times i get out the big guns

i couldn't possibly tell you what size sinker to use because every wash is different and you will need to change weight according to tide and conditions....if a fellow raider offers to show you whats up it will save you mountains of time...

i took some pics to show you an easy ( the only) way to present bread on a hook. i was shown this ages ago by a mullet fisho...

around this size is good... don't squash the bread the fluffier and fresher the better use stale bread and crusts for berley

place hook thru top corner of bread carefully

push right thru to eye and place hook back thru bread as shown

squash only the top corner of bread back around the shank...you want the hook point well exposed, surrounded by soft fluffy bread...

this will stay on surprisingly long.a solid ball of dough on a hook is much less effective...when you get a hit and all you have left is a little squashed bread rebait...i use bread because i can get it to waft and suspend in the wash zone better than a prawn, but peeled prawns are still the gun bait, or cunji....

you then need to present this somewhere that a pig might find it..i find the last two hours of the run in best, but the pigs will move spots accrding to the tide so you might have to move a few times to find the fish. the pigs will usually be in the wash at your feet so long casts are not needed often... look for milky water with water pouring back into the ocean off a ledge after most waves...the pigs will be tight to the rocks under that milky water...

this brings me to the fact that you won't catch drummer unless there is some swell about ... without that surge and whitewater they stay in their caves all day... so expect to get hit by waves when fishing like this... just be careful... some of our better pig spots involve casting when you get a break between sets and scampering when you have to...when you get onto a nice fish you can get into some gnarly situations because you are not watching the ocean... don't fish in more than 2 m of swell unless you really know the spot and conditions...

last of all, dont think you need to fish deep water... my favourite spot was under sand for two years but now its cleaned out and it is shallow, reefy and fun. these reefs change on a daily basis with sand movement so you constantly need to explore...

drummer are surprisingly easy to catch danilo and they might be the perfect fish for you to get into

sorry for the essay lol

[arpie]

Hi Danilo

Some excellent advice there from lots of Raiders .... just be ready for that drummer take off & HANG ON!! They are very powerful & will try to take you back into the rocks. You need to turn their heads & keep winding to stop them busting you off.

Good Luck

Roberta

PS A bit of cunje on a small hook with a pea size hook, after a big swell will do the trick as well!

Edited November 12, 2007 by Roberta

[luderick59]

if fishing for pigs using bread as berley tryusing tripe for bait it stays on the hook longer

i use a 1/0 xx strong suicide no lead if possible flick the tripe in amongst the bread berley and hang on

it fluffs up under water and looks like bread but its got to be in there with the berley

be safe allways wear cleats

peter

[davester28]

I have never fished for drummer or blackies either, so this is an interesting topic.

Just a quick question: if you don't use floats, how do you avoid having your bait snagging at the bottom in the rocky terrain in which these fish are usually caught? Despite using even small pea-sized sinkers, won't the bait eventually waft to the bottom and get hopelessly snagged?

[coastspinna]

I have never fished for drummer or blackies either, so this is an interesting topic.

Just a quick question: if you don't use floats, how do you avoid having your bait snagging at the bottom in the rocky terrain in which these fish are usually caught? Despite using even small pea-sized sinkers, won't the bait eventually waft to the bottom and get hopelessly snagged?

good question david

you will get snagged often fishin for these guys...thats par for the course....

we minimise this as much as we can by lifting the rod tip up regularly and reel in a bit of line to keep the bait suspending so each cast might only be out for minute or less... also by using small sinkers{pea size is 2 big...) you minimise the time you spend snagged up... that said it is a fine line because you need your bait in those cracks and crevices in the first place....on a good session we would go through 15 hooks each in a day to snags or fish...so when you find a good brand that are cheap load up... i figure what i lose in hooks i save by using bread for bait, plus i don't lose my blackfish floats...

if fishing for pigs using bread as berley tryusing tripe for bait it stays on the hook longer

i use a 1/0 xx strong suicide no lead if possible flick the tripe in amongst the bread berley and hang on

it fluffs up under water and looks like bread but its got to be in there with the berley

be safe allways wear cleats

peter

nice tip peter... would that tripe work on mullet do you reckon??

[luderick59]

it works on mullet as long as there is a berley trail just the same as a fly fisher would use a imitation bread fly its cheap and goes a long way as long as you keep it cut small for mullet

peter

[davester28]

good question david

you will get snagged often fishin for these guys...thats par for the course....

we minimise this as much as we can by lifting the rod tip up regularly and reel in a bit of line to keep the bait suspending so each cast might only be out for minute or less... also by using small sinkers{pea size is 2 big...) you minimise the time you spend snagged up... that said it is a fine line because you need your bait in those cracks and crevices in the first place....on a good session we would go through 15 hooks each in a day to snags or fish...so when you find a good brand that are cheap load up... i figure what i lose in hooks i save by using bread for bait, plus i don't lose my blackfish floats...

thanks for the great info FF, may have to give it a go sometime soon!