SquidMarks Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 billfisher, i condone safe practice in the workplace but with some things are OTT, again, go onto a baking forum, i doubt you will find anyone placing caveats on baking bread and flour explosions. You will not get a thermite reaction from using a cutting wheel with iron oxide, the ratio of iorn oxide to aluminium are way off there to generate a thermite reaction. Its the same with people lighting a ciggarette when on a boat, theoretically, if the tank breather is within a specific distance and we get a specific concentration of fuel to air ratio due to a certain wind which has blown it to the cigarette at a specific temperature then we can (and will) get a combustion reaction. Can you name me an aluminium cutting method used at home which will result in the required particles size for a combustion? Aluminium is combustible, im not arguing the point (i mentioned its combustable already), so what are we talking about here? the odds of joe bloe creating a combustion reaction are almost non existent unless he is really trying hard to actually create said reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquidMarks Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 BACK ON TOPIC: I have measured the distance between ally stringers in the boat. Theres one with a 450mm width the rest are 39mm width. 3mm 1200 x 2400 5052 ally sheet costs approx $140 per sheet and im going to need 3 sheets (well, two and a quater but i doubt they will sell me a quarter sheet). I can get 4mm 1200 x 2400 5083 sheet (plate) but thats $210 per sheet not sure if i will get away with 3mm here with such widths... any opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amkr Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I've tried to make thermite at home, aside from the incredibly high (beyond grinding disc) temperatures you need to ignite it. Its hard to get enough of the materials in the right particle size and correct ratio. Take it from someone who's tried, scraping the rust off the surface of a piece of metal doesn't cut it.Theres more chance of being attacked by a shark when cutting the materials in the shed than there is of accidentally creating a thermite reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbink Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 billfisher, i condone safe practice in the workplace but with some things are OTT, again, go onto a baking forum, i doubt you will find anyone placing caveats on baking bread and flour explosions. You will not get a thermite reaction from using a cutting wheel with iron oxide, the ratio of iorn oxide to aluminium are way off there to generate a thermite reaction. Its the same with people lighting a ciggarette when on a boat, theoretically, if the tank breather is within a specific distance and we get a specific concentration of fuel to air ratio due to a certain wind which has blown it to the cigarette at a specific temperature then we can (and will) get a combustion reaction. Can you name me an aluminium cutting method used at home which will result in the required particles size for a combustion? Aluminium is combustible, im not arguing the point (i mentioned its combustable already), so what are we talking about here? the odds of joe bloe creating a combustion reaction are almost non existent unless he is really trying hard to actually create said reaction. The fact is that explosions as I have described, though unlikely, have have happened. On top of that accidents from angle grinders kicking back or disks exploding when cutting metal are not infrequent. Offiicial safety guidlines for angle gringers usually state that alternative (ie safer methods) should be considered first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amkr Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 The fact is that explosions as I have described, though unlikely, have have happened. On top of that accidents from angle grinders kicking back or disks exploding when cutting metal are not infrequent. Offiicial safety guidlines for angle gringers usually state that alternative (ie safer methods) should be considered first. Do you warn people about sharks every time they go near the water? Or lighting every time there's a storm because ' though unlikely, have have happened' Angle Grinder discs exploding can happen with any material, it is not limited to aluminium. You've done your utmost best to try and derail this thread with semantics and factually incorrect information. Let the poor guy get some relevant information about his flooring without being harassed about a 0.00003% chance of accidentally making thermite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquidMarks Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 billfisher.. im not using an angle grinder.... read the above posts mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amkr Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 And just so we're clear. Bosch makes an aluminium cutting disc for angle grinders - rated at 13,200 RPM.As do flexovit and numerous other companies who I'm sure have the knowledge and experience to know what they are doing - considering that is their field of expertise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjbink Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 (edited) billfisher.. im not using an angle grinder.... read the above posts mate. I did just point that out in a post. Edited November 9, 2015 by billfisher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambrose607 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 All the grinders jigsaws explosives will be useless if ADMIN put a big padlock on this thread as none of them will be able to reopen it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquidMarks Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 excellent.., so now.. lets try get back here as my question has been lost again somehow amongst the bickering BACK ON TOPIC: I have measured the distance between ally stringers in the boat. Theres one with a 450mm width the rest are 39mm width. 3mm 1200 x 2400 5052 ally sheet costs approx $140 per sheet and im going to need 3 sheets (well, two and a quater but i doubt they will sell me a quarter sheet). I can get 4mm 1200 x 2400 5083 sheet (plate) but thats $210 per sheet not sure if i will get away with 3mm here with such widths... any opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cameldownunder Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 What about 10mm Acrylic Sheet Available 1220mm x 2440mm for $300. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquidMarks Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 acrylic will work but again, the price difference is high. (the 4mm 5083 ally should work just fine considering its used to build barcrusher boats up to 6m) at $200 a sheet. Im trying to see if i can get away with 3mm instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsswordfisherman Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 OK guys I have had quite enough of this rubbish. No one wants to read arguments. Take it up with each other on a pm or get a phone and call each other if need be. I am giving one FINAL WARNING - any member who is disrespectful on my forum will be removed and banned. I am putting 3 members here on mod watch until I see that this has stopped. Very sorry to the original poster SquidMarks who has asked for help. As you were gents ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsswordfisherman Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 All the grinders jigsaws explosives will be useless if ADMIN put a big padlock on this thread as none of them will be able to reopen it. Yes if it is useless waste of space then I will delete it ambrose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oz_brett Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Ok, i have been sitting on this problem for wayyy to long! The current plywood floor is squishy and i fear my foot will fall through at any moment. I have started a thread a while back with flooring alternatives but my procrastination and cheapskatedness (is there a word?) has got the best of me. I was looking at replacing it with extruded poly foam but it looks like its unstable when it comes in contact with fuel so id rather get something that wont melt on me. Im not going down the plywood, seal and hope for the best and would rather spend a bit more moolah and do the job right! Im going to buy ally sheet 5052 grade (marine) and will be looking to glue on top a non slip vinyl of sorts and hopefully that will be the end of that. Now, my main concern is what thickness of sheet could i use? The boat is a quintrex and i understand that thickness depends on sub floor frame and how the floor is supported, but im guessing 3mm ought to be enough (considering the bottom of the boat is 3mm press out of the same material). The question i ask, am i wasting money paying for 3mm when 2mm might be enough? (since ally is sold by the kg, 3mm vs 2mm equals a 33% difference in price). Im not a metallurgist but im hoping someone with experience may be able to chime in? Like you squidmaks Ive been looking at replacing my floor for some time now, I am moving away from the thought of alloy as I dont want to weld it down if I screw it down I think the alloy sheet will wear allowing the screws to come loose over time as will the plastic options so Im now starting to think maybe they use ply for other reasond other then just cost cutting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danieljc Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I just had my floor replaced. It was orginally ply with carpet. I was looking at going down the alloy path but in the end went with ply and carpet again and am pretty happy with how it came out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antonywardle Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I think that the wood is a friendlier option. I just like the look of wood, although in this case, you wont see it under the carpet. I'm guessing your alloy is going to be lighter and you won't need to seal it. Can you get a piece of 3mm then put it between a couple of brick and stand on it to check the flex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquidMarks Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 that was going to be my next move.. see if the father in law has some scrap and give it a hit. Im really going towards the alloy because i dont want to think about rot and would like it to last as long as the boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fisherman666 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I still think you should just chuck in the std 12 mm cheap ply. Doesn't affect the boat structurally at all. If you are concerned about the rot, just use manageable size floor pieces and pull the floor out between trips. Takes me 2 mins to pull out my floor (4.5 m tinny CC). Last a very long time if you do that Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquidMarks Posted November 10, 2015 Author Share Posted November 10, 2015 But if i need to replace the ply 2-3 times over the life of the boat then it would end up being cheaper going the ally in the long run... (and not having to redo a job every 7-10 years). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquidMarks Posted November 11, 2015 Author Share Posted November 11, 2015 Just for anyone still following this thread after all the bickering. I had a sample of 3mm ally sheet and used it to check for flex. It held together and but showed deflection with both feet placed between a stringer so decision has been made to go for the 4mm aluminium plate 5083. That should be more than enough. Also, the stringers used to support the deck on the quintrex do not extend up to the gunwale but end about an inch from the boats sides. I have also bought some 4mm aluminium angle to join the stringers to add additional support on the outside. I might take a photo or 2 to explain what i mean later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric001 Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 Hi Squid, will you install rubber strip between stringers and floor plate? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welster Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Please keep us updated as you progress it will be interesting to see how it goes. Does rubber and aluminium react? I think I read something about its carbon content. But I think something between the two would be worthwhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric001 Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 On Aircraft , I've seen cork and Teflon tape as an insulator between interfaces and it helps reduce vibration noise. It might be something to consider. Rubberised/foam tape is a good alternative. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p-ziller Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Ok, i have been sitting on this problem for wayyy to long! The current plywood floor is squishy and i fear my foot will fall through at any moment. I have started a thread a while back with flooring alternatives but my procrastination and cheapskatedness (is there a word?) has got the best of me. I was looking at replacing it with extruded poly foam but it looks like its unstable when it comes in contact with fuel so id rather get something that wont melt on me. Im not going down the plywood, seal and hope for the best and would rather spend a bit more moolah and do the job right! Im going to buy ally sheet 5052 grade (marine) and will be looking to glue on top a non slip vinyl of sorts and hopefully that will be the end of that. Now, my main concern is what thickness of sheet could i use? The boat is a quintrex and i understand that thickness depends on sub floor frame and how the floor is supported, but im guessing 3mm ought to be enough (considering the bottom of the boat is 3mm press out of the same material). The question i ask, am i wasting money paying for 3mm when 2mm might be enough? (since ally is sold by the kg, 3mm vs 2mm equals a 33% difference in price). Im not a metallurgist but im hoping someone with experience may be able to chime in? Squid Marks, To answer your question mate, Ally in a heavy gauge will still be less stable than most other sheet metal types as it is light weight. However this will not effect its durability. I work in a sheet metal factory in Western Sydney and can gladly state that we have never had any accidents of any type whilst using ally apart from the occasional burr cutting a finger. I am soon to be refurbing my boat too and i am opting for a similar approach. However, I will be making floor bracing with appropriate gussets out of ally SHS 25 X 25 X 3 or 20 X 20 X 3 (depending on availability) and laying carpeted and sealed marine ply on top. i will be doing the same with the fuel and battery enclosures and casting deck. If you would like any help send me a PM, but i would advise getting a qualified trades person to weld it up for you, there is an art to welding aluminum. If you could design it and have it ready to weld, give the old gumtree a visit and search for a welder. You are bound to find somebody that would help out for a small cost. Hope this helps! Cheers, Paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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