Leader strength and reel drag setting for small kingfish off rocks

[savit]

Hi All ,

Got busted off by a mean kingy off rocks last weekend. It was fun on a light gear until the fish moved back to the rocks.

So, what minimum leader strength and reel drag setting are suggested for small kings off rocks.  

Thanks.

[JonD]

Wow that's a hard one to answere, even small undersized kings can work you over when using a light long rod from the rocks. Trouble is if you go to heavy and get snagged it can be very hard to break out.( you may even damage the rod or reel doing so)

You could do a test to see what sort of lifting power you can put through the outfit you plan to use by simply applying a measured weight on the end of the outfit. If you can easely handle 7kg or more you might want to look at 20-30 lb braid, my guess is 7kg will be your limit on a quality outfit. 

The leaders will come down whether you think you can stop then smashing around the bottom but I would be starting at least 50 lb leaders, this is pretty much what I use in the boat all the time.

By the way the biggest kings we see while in the water are around shallow rocks, my daughter recently took a 1.30 cm angry king. It's not just rats that lurk around the rocks so watch you don't get pulled in, seriously.

Edited May 15, 2017 by JonD

[Green Hornet]

I reckon a good rule of thumb to start with is your leader should be at least twice the strength of your main line. Then you need to factor things in like can you wash the fish out or do you need to lift it and also the type of rock platform you're fishing ie,  is it a vertical ledge into deep water or are there lots of rocks covered in cunji and barnacles in close?

Say you're fishing 20lb braid, I'd be starting out with a leader around 50lb and go as hard as you can on them, specially when they're in close around anything snaggy.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Green Hornet

[savit]

Thank you, guys.

I have a separate setup with 60lb leader for larger fish.

A lot of barnacles, 1-2m vertical ledge, so, should not be a problem to lift with landing net or gaff.

The king was a bycatch on a lighter 6-10kg 10' bait rod with mono and 15lb fluoro leader. 50lb leader upgrade seems to be too much for this rig.    

 

[Guest Guest123456789]

Your maximum drag is determined by how big your hook is. How big is your hook? Single or treble? What brand?

[savit]

Usually I use size 4 baitholder as a single or a small gang on a lighter bait rod for landbased fishing. So far the hook handled everything that 15lb leader could handle - so I presume at least 2.5 kg drag ( 1/3 of 15lb leader). Not sure about the brand, its cheap from Big W. It does not have (much) carbon as it bends a bit and is good for small gangs.

 

 

[Guest Guest123456789]

Smaller, cheaper hooks from big w - I'd be scared to tighten the drag too much for fear of pulling the hook or even straightening the hook.

[savit]

6 minutes ago, flatheadluke said:

Smaller, cheaper hooks from big w - I'd be scared to tighten the drag too much for fear of pulling the hook or even straightening the hook.

So, how far would you tighten your reel drag on 15lb line for owner/gamakatsu/whatever?

[Guest Guest123456789]

12 minutes ago, savit said:

So, how far would you tighten your reel drag on 15lb line for owner/gamakatsu/whatever?

You'd want it pretty tight to keep em off the rocks right?

[savit]

yes.

[Guest Guest123456789]

You can give it to them a bit, often more than you would think especially if you've got faith in your knots. On Saturday a big bloody ray took my soft plastic. On 10lbs braid with 6kg leader with a 4000 reel that has 6 kg of drag I locked it up when it hit the mono backing. I only just managed to snap it off (thankfully at the hook) and that was high sticking it and thumbing the spool. That was using a 5 inch soft plastic with a TT 1/8 jighead with a 2/0 or 3/0 hook (those stronger silver hooks not those piss weak black ones).

[rickmarlin62]

there are two ways to fight kings..one is fish heavy and go for broke ..usual outcome is they give you more than you give them...gone..second is the softly softly technique..you let them run out wider then give them heaps till they come closer then repeat and backoff let them run out again when out over sand or away from rocks belt it to them again then go softly on them when in close..sometimes it works sometimes not...ive landed 18kg king off wybung on 6kg with this method and been dusted by pups on 24kg  ...no 4 baitholders arnt exactly ideal for kings so I would be lookin at upgrading your tackle before next encounter..rick

[savit]

Just to remind and clarify:  It is a 2nd/light rod used to catch live bait and smaller species. I have a stronger rod with 60lb leader and plenty of owner/mustad hooks from 4/0 up to 9/0 for targetting larger species.

What I wanted to check here - if I can stop small kings with small leader upgrade and tighter drag setting without sacrificing light rod main purpose (collecting live bait and catching smaller species). 

@flatheadluke, you probably have very good knots to run 6kg drag on 6kg leader.

@rickmarlin62, I heard about soft technique for kings, what drag do you use for this technique and how much line the fish might take?

[dirvin21]

landbased kings are completely different to boat based in a boat you want to muscle them up off the reef and steer them to open water for landing, landbased you need to bring them up to the structure to land them so the trick is to not upset them too much

fish a light drag about what you would set for an average bream drag

let them run, I have landed  kingies on bream gear landbased (as by-catch) and its just a matter of letting them run themselves out of energy, don't be afraid to let them go I've had one run nearly 80m at least three times before giving up,  but the second you tighten up and try and muscle them they will bury you in an instant     

I am not an expert on the topic most of my kingies (biggest 65cm) have come as by-catch whilst bream spinning with 6lb braid and 8lb leader if I was to seriously target them (small models) I would go 250-300m of 15lb braid with 20lb fluorocarbon leader

hope this helps

Dave

[rickmarlin62]

there is no exact drag setting its all about feel..don't stroke and wind like crazy just back the drag off and try to lead them with slow deliberate rod movements  .that's why its called softly softly..rick

[JonD]

The fish that was lost was using light gear with a more softly softly approach which was why he was after advice. I think from the replys you can gather that something may work, you just need to keep trying. A mate of mine had the land based kingy record on 6lb line from Merimbula, he said it was a fluke and was never able to slow another down after that one. 

Do you ever watch Big Angry fish ? If not watch a few epesodes the land based kings they catch are stonkers, they seem to give everything plenty of muscle.

[savit]

Thanks everyone for comments, it is always good to learn from other fishos experiences. The reel was small size Alvey 500C5, so it was just 'slow winching' with 1:1 retrieve ratio, drag was set probably to about 3-3.5 kg. Though, I think it was still a bit annoying to the fish as it ran 3 directions until it dived under the ledge.

[krause]

Disclaimer: most of my kings are yak based haha

I think jonD and his mate have got it right, it's a fluke. Lots of muscle, no muscle, if that fish wants to reef you it'll damn well do it, especially land based where all they have to do is arc down into the rocks at your feet. You just need to hook a king that doesn't work it out fast enough haha. 

The one thing that is fact is that if you go hard, they'll double your effort. So be smart and choose when you pull hard.

As for the original question, i like my 20lb for dead baits, 40lb for livies, and i run my drag at an unknown value that feels right.