Reel' em in Posted December 29, 2017 Share Posted December 29, 2017 Hi Guys I was fishing the other day and lost a big fish to a pulled knot, in my 25 years of fishing I have never had a knot pull on me before and the only thing I can think of is that I started using fluorocarbon leader in stead of mono, size of leader was 60lbs and knot used was a uni knot, has anyone else had this problem ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmk1962 Posted December 29, 2017 Share Posted December 29, 2017 I use the uni knot on both fluorocarbon and mono leaders. Has not (knot!) failed me yet !! How many turns did you put in it? I usually go 4 on the lighter lines and 3 on the heavier. By heavier I mean the line diameter not necessarily the breaking strain. So generally if over 0.6mm I do 3 turns otherwise it bulks up too much. I did notice the other day, I had sunscreen lotion on my hands and the knot was slipping more when I tightened it down...so made sure I left a slightly longer tag until I was satisfied it had locked down. Cheers Zoran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel' em in Posted December 30, 2017 Author Share Posted December 30, 2017 yea I usually wrap it around 5 or 6 times light & heavy line, i might start leaving the tag end a bit longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I use both in terms with the knot I don't have any problems with the knot failing only when I tighten my knot for some reason the braid snaps about 2" above the knot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickmarlin62 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I would be replacing that braid..is it old ???...rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 only about 1 year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmk1962 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 (edited) 49 minutes ago, marks1984 said: .... for some reason the braid snaps about 2" above the knot Hi marks1984, I think reel' em in was using the uni knot for leader to terminal tackle such as a hook. You mention your braid snapping 2" above the knot .... are you using the uni knot to tie the leader to the braid? There are better knots for this job - albright modified, FG etc. What knot are you using - is this damaging your braid? Also if the braid is consistently snapping 2" above the knot... maybe review how you tightening the knots up. Are you wrapping the braid around something to help tighten it up ... is this damaging your braid 2" from the knot? Cheers Z Edited January 3, 2018 by zmk1962 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonD Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Is there any chance you sprayed down your reel with a protective lubricant after the last trip. Or maybe tied the knot with greasy hands from sun block or the lubricant on soft plastics etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 16 minutes ago, zmk1962 said: Hi marks1984, I think reel' em in was using the uni knot for leader to terminal tackle such as a hook. You mention your braid snapping 2" above the knot .... are you using the uni knot to tie the leader to the braid? There are better knots for this job - albright modified, FG etc. What knot are you using - is this damaging your braid? Also if the braid is consistently snapping 2" above the knot... maybe review how you tightening the knots up. Are you wrapping the braid around something to help tighten it up ... is this damaging your braid 2" from the knot? Cheers Z I am using a double uni knot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmk1962 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I have no experience with a double uni as a knot for leader to braid connection. But looking at the knot and how its tied... 2" from where the knot ends is about where you would start your leader over braid wraps ....so speculating could the force of the leader locking down on itself be tearing apart the trapped braid at that point... and then when you pull the two uni's together that weaker braid spot is about 2" up? what size braid and what size leader ? Just speculation mate. Cheers Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Mr. Z, yes I have thought that I have been making the initial knot tight before I pull them together but no I have left it lose at times heaps of spit as well this has got me Fed. I am using 10lbs cast away braid and 10lbs fluro as trace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmk1962 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 26 minutes ago, marks1984 said: Mr. Z, yes I have thought that I have been making the initial knot tight before I pull them together but no I have left it lose at times heaps of spit as well this has got me Fed. I am using 10lbs cast away braid and 10lbs fluro as trace How long is your leader? Also how do you know you are snapping 2" up from knot? Are you casting with your braid through the runners, leaving 2" of braid hanging from the rod tip and then you have the leader tied on. Cheers Z PS: braid is not good for casting like that - most folks run leader through to the reel with 2-3 turns around the reel spool. Hence a low profile knot like albright or FG so it can feed through the rod runners and tip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewhunter Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I don't like a double uni in 60lb leader. Too bulky & hard to lock down. Do the FG & it will never happen again. 2 hours ago, zmk1962 said: PS: braid is not good for casting like that - most folks run leader through to the reel with 2-3 turns around the reel spool. Hence a low profile knot like albright or FG so it can feed through the rod runners and tip. Sorry mate. I don't agree with the above. Leaving any leader with loops on the reel is a recipe for all sorts of problems. Keep the leader off the reel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berleyguts Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 38 minutes ago, Jewhunter said: I don't like a double uni in 60lb leader. Too bulky & hard to lock down. Do the FG & it will never happen again. Sorry mate. I don't agree with the above. Leaving any leader with loops on the reel is a recipe for all sorts of problems. Keep the leader off the reel. Do you mean for casting? I use wind on leaders on my trolling outfits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 5 hours ago, zmk1962 said: How long is your leader? Also how do you know you are snapping 2" up from knot? Are you casting with your braid through the runners, leaving 2" of braid hanging from the rod tip and then you have the leader tied on. Cheers Z PS: braid is not good for casting like that - most folks run leader through to the reel with 2-3 turns around the reel spool. Hence a low profile knot like albright or FG so it can feed through the rod runners and tip. Before I go out i always re tie my knots i normally if i have not fished in a while ill take a rod length or two. My leader is 1-1.5 meter long i don' like my knot going past the eyes i did t want to take the chance to damage the knot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewhunter Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 1 hour ago, Berleyguts said: Do you mean for casting? I use wind on leaders on my trolling outfits. Yes mate, casting on any gear. Trolling is fine. I do the same, but trying to cast any braid to leader from 2-50lb with the leader on the spool just doesn't work too well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berleyguts Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 1 minute ago, Jewhunter said: Yes mate, casting on any gear. Trolling is fine. I do the same, but trying to cast any braid to leader from 2-50lb with the leader on the spool just doesn't work too well. Cool. Under ANSA rules I can only have a maximum leader/double combined length of 1.5 times the rod length anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmk1962 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Berleyguts and Jewhunter... I hear you. The whole topic of leader lengths has been covered before on fishraider ... the general conclusion there was "it depends" .... largely on what type of fishing folks do. Myself and most of the folks I go fishing with do a lot of trolling and bottom bashing - so most of our rods have leaders with couple of turns on the spool (not fishing comp or ANSA etc). Most fish are lost around the boat and a longer leader helps there. For these rods we use an Improved or Modified Albright (quicker and simpler to tie than an FG). I have two rods set up for casting largely metals slices at schools offshore and a few wraps of leader on a longcast spool with an FG knot has not been an issue for me. Casts fine for me, the mono leader is comfy on the fingers during the cast and I am yet to have braid snap or snag, but then again I don't spend all day casting and I don't need max distance or accuracy for the casts. So back to marks1984 question, the issue we were discussing is why is marks1984 consistently seeing his braid snap about 2" above the knot using 10lb leader and 10lb braid....and I think his last post gave a hint there... if the leader is only 1-1.5m long as he does not like it going through the rod runners, I suspect its snapping at the top runner from the strain and abrasion wear and tear that builds up at that point. My proposed solution would be to learn to tie a low profile FG knot and run a longer leader in through the rod runners. Any other ideas we can give marks1984? Cheers Zoran 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ledge Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I find fluoro knots tighten down a bit more than mono when under stress. Not slip, more tighten down that bit more when first put under load. When I first swapped to fluoro I had the same issues so I started leaving just slightly longer tag ends and haven’t had the problem since. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickmarlin62 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 you can always go to a short double then when you join your trace to doubled braid may stop your problem...rick 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 thanks all I need to learn the FG knot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 just found this bad boy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmk1962 Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 Thats the one !!! .... BTW, if you are still unhappy about running the leader with FG knot through the rod runners also take on board Rick's advice about doubling your braid where its snapping - a spider hitch knot is what I used to use with mono and should work well with braid given the number of turns you typically put in it. Cheers and best of luck.... Zoran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MainframeJames Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 3 hours ago, marks1984 said: thanks all I need to learn the FG knot I agree. I find it slips through the rings smoothly and winds without issues. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marks1984 Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 14 hours ago, zmk1962 said: Berleyguts and Jewhunter... I hear you. The whole topic of leader lengths has been covered before on fishraider ... the general conclusion there was "it depends" .... largely on what type of fishing folks do. Myself and most of the folks I go fishing with do a lot of trolling and bottom bashing - so most of our rods have leaders with couple of turns on the spool (not fishing comp or ANSA etc). Most fish are lost around the boat and a longer leader helps there. For these rods we use an Improved or Modified Albright (quicker and simpler to tie than an FG). I have two rods set up for casting largely metals slices at schools offshore and a few wraps of leader on a longcast spool with an FG knot has not been an issue for me. Casts fine for me, the mono leader is comfy on the fingers during the cast and I am yet to have braid snap or snag, but then again I don't spend all day casting and I don't need max distance or accuracy for the casts. So back to marks1984 question, the issue we were discussing is why is marks1984 consistently seeing his braid snap about 2" above the knot using 10lb leader and 10lb braid....and I think his last post gave a hint there... if the leader is only 1-1.5m long as he does not like it going through the rod runners, I suspect its snapping at the top runner from the strain and abrasion wear and tear that builds up at that point. My proposed solution would be to learn to tie a low profile FG knot and run a longer leader in through the rod runners. Any other ideas we can give marks1984? Cheers Zoran that's the reason why I don't want my knots passing past my eyes I don't want it to get damaged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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