wazatherfisherman

G'day Turtletown I haven't fished the spit for them myself but have seen guys fishing at spot '2' on the run in tide and almost exactly between spots '3' and '4' towards the moored boats on the top of the tide. I mainly fished for them at Cremorne Wharf, Taronga Park wharf(fishing no longer allowed there sadly) Bradleys Head(old stone wall)and White Rock(see directions in this forum on Bradleys Head) Of the spots I've mentioned Cremorne Wharf is always worth a drift from the western side, you start your drift about 4-5 mtrs out from the centre of this side and you want it to drift towards the wharf. where there is a natural eddy. I found changing float depth frequently is more important at this location than any of the others from as shallow as 2.7 mtr's down to about 5 mtr's. Weed and cabbage both get fish here. This side accommodates about 3 Luderick fishers comfortably and you are out of the way of ferry/passengers. Berleying just a little with sand/weed is advisable but not essential as ferry movement/surge dislodges a bit of marine growth and I reckon the fish are on the lookout for food naturally after each ferry leaves. The north east corner of the wharf can produce a few as well, fish close to the wharf about 3-3.5 mtr's deep but only towards the top of the tide and its nowhere near as reliable as the west side. Most importantly when fishing most of the lower harbour wharves make sure your float(bottom ballasted floats best here) is weighted right down to no more than 1 cm above water(even lower is better) as you can easily see it and are always fishing close to it- there's no need for long drifts or very much float stem above the water and the fish will take it more freely without letting go. About 60-70 cm of .20 gauge(2.3-3 kg) trace(leader)between last lead and hook as a minimum is also my recommendation. I've been using 5 and a half pound and six and a half pound Tortue for leader for over 40 years, it stands up well to all the half-hitches you use when baiting up and in my opinion is better than fluorocarbon for this reason. I would agree of course that the latter is more abrasion resistant and far less visible. Although exposed to Westerly winds the wharf fishes well then and can be fished in a slight S/E also. A landing net of 1 to 2 mtr's is long enough here as well. At Bradleys Head you fish the old stone wall below and to the right of the mast of The Sydney. Years ago, this spot had a wharf that jutted out from the wall that still remains and it was then one of Sydney Harbour's best Luderick spots. I'm not exactly sure if this wharf was destroyed by storms, misadventure, simply removed for maintenance reasons or something to do with the National Park, however, the stone wall that remains is still a good, productive spot and I reckon is a good place to regain your Luderick skills as there are always a few fish and sometimes a lot. Fish can be caught here on both tides and unlike Cremorne, there is a lot more water movement and longer drifts are the norm. If you get your choice of wall 'corners' the right hand corner is the best and you can drift as far as 30-40 mtr's towards the Harbour Bridge and get fish anywhere up that stretch. I think this spot often see's bigger schools of Luderick come through as they travel around the lower harbour and I've fished there a couple of times with half a dozen other guys and seen everyone hooked up at the same time. On big high tides when there's a decent weed growth on the shore sometimes the fish will venture about half way along the western side of the wall and can be caught fishing 'shallow' about 2.5 mtr's deep, otherwise fishing between 2,7 and 3.7 mtr's deep is the go. A landing net of 1.5-3 mtr's is an asset,or you can walk any big fish along the wall and simply wash them up on the small beach. Due to more tidal influence and 'run' in the water we usually use a lighter version of 'fixed' ocean rock floats(high ballasted) when fishing the stone wall as the fish bite more aggressively in this type of water, allowing a longer topped/stemmed float which is necessary for detecting 'downs' in both quicker drifts and longer distances. Black tipped floats are used when fishing here of an afternoon as you are looking towards the sun. A shorter distance between last lead and hook(about 50 cm) works well on bigger faster flowing tides here. Weed always seems to catch more fish than cabbage at this spot,I think that could be because there are several patches around the headland where weed constantly grows and very occasionally you can get a little of it for bait, but it's never very long as I think the fish get at it on the bigger tides of a night. This spot is one spot that fishes ok in N/E winds and although a bit cold in westerly's also fishes well then. Avoid it in S-S/E winds over 15 knots as it's a bit more difficult to fish and there doesn't seem to be as many fish then either. If the Luderick aren't biting, a size 8 longshank baited with peeled prawn under your float produces some large leatherjackets here and at times there are Surgeons around that provide a bit of excitement if you hook one on weed. Hope this is useful info and if you need to know anything else that might help or want specific info on White Rock's Luderick spot just let me know. Cheers and good luck.

As Blaxland said bobby cork well worth trying also. Ganged hooks in live-bait are fine,been using them for many years. As it gets cooler John Dory also likely candidates and one of my mates has caught quite a few in Bantry Bay, so they certainly go upstream of The Spit. Tailor are also commonly caught fishing the bottom in deep water

G'day Turtletown try this rig:- ball sinker on mainline,small bead(to stop sinker getting stuck on swivel) then swivel. Then 60cm(any longer you start losing casting distance) fluorocarbon leader in 25-30lb range then 2 snooded suicide(octopus) 4/0 or 5/0's. You might lose a few rigs to snags(if snaggy!)but it's quick,easy,uncomplicated and the predator can easily run off with your bait. Tailor will often bite your live-baits in half and miss the hook/s by millimetres, but persevere as some will swallow the lot. Don't use wire unless you are after Hairtail or XOS Tailor as you'll get far fewer enquiries. If you like you could substitute the snooded hooks for a set of either 2 or 3 ganged hooks roughly 4/0 "Mustad 8260 or 4200 patterns (depending on yellowtail size). This set-up has worked for me for many years live-baiting on the bottom in the harbour

Thanks mate,I mainly fished the Mattens and played a small part in developing the spot at the Lighthouse(below Macquarie)but the climb there was terrifying to say the least. For the most part the Mattens was the safest once you'd got to the bottom and the guys that died didn't fall off the rope climbs,they fell from the goat track over 200 ft up, simply tripping or mis-negotiating a step. I copped a fractured skull but not from falling(story is in "most painful fishing things") and every other guy who fished there had at least 1 "close call" including things like having climbing ropes cut while we were at the bottom. Two incidents on the same day finally stopped me going there after 22 yrs. A pigeon that had been nesting unseen in a crevice, flew out between my face and the cliff and I was about 60 ft up on the flat wall- got me so off-guard I spun around backwards,ending up wrong way around on the cliff. I had to 'slide' down about 8 feet to turn around and rope burned both hands. Earlier in the day the four of us there had stopped for a quick feed and on walking back out in single file from our under-cliff lunch spot, a blue tongue lizard fell from the cliff and landed between myself and the guy six foot in front of me. It splattered all over us and spread over a fair area. We all laughed at the time that it would have been a lousy thing to have on your headstone "Here lies Warren, killed by a blue tongued lizard" but that followed by the pigeon the same day was enough for me.

Really sorry to hear you lost a mate there. I lost several mates fishing the Mattens at Dover Heights and had a near death accident there myself. I stopped going there for safety reasons. Even when conditions are favourable, ALL Sydney rock platforms are really dangerous, no matter what your experience level

G'day again Macbook, if you look on google maps at Rayner Rd South Whale Beach and go to satellite image, the spot I know as South Whale is marked Devils Cauldron and Careel Head. The "Ovens" is directly below to the right at the very end of the Road

G'day again Macbook, like Scottyboy I haven't fished there for more than 12y rs either, but 'back in the day' the ovens produced heaps of big tuna ,kings and gamefish for live-bait anglers by day plus Big Mulloway and a lot of big sharks live-baiting of a night, There must still be a way down as when trolling past in the boat a couple of years ago, there were about 10 guys fishing there. However, this was primarily a live-bait spot and South Whale more favoured by spin fisho's. It is a fair walk around from the ocean pool. The easy access used to be from the same then vacant lot in Rayner Rd then down an easy 10 metre rope assisted climb, pretty much the same as the ovens. If you take the long walk around to South Whale don't go in any sort of a sea as it's a low platform and rock plates are also essential. An interesting by-catch of the area(although cursed by the live-baiter's) are really large Long Tom's which were often encountered when fishing there. Luderick are also regularly taken at South Whale and it produces giant Pigs(Black Drummer) during their spawning season around late September til end of October. Hope you find an easier route there and good luck. Like Scottyboy said let us know how you go

Thanks mate, like most guys who fished the big cliffs I have heaps of similar stories of accidents and rescues. I am REALLY lucky to have survived that night, one more foot or roll and I was 'burley'

South Whale is a great spinning spot for Kings and Bonnies and in October some huge Pigs lurk in the washes there. The "ovens" about 400 mtr's further southeast good live-baiting spot but I don't know what access is like these days. Used to go to end of Rayner Rd and go down through vacant block between houses, but there's probably someone on here that would know new route down

G'day Nutsabtfishn I used to fish The Mattens at Dover Heights(for 22yrs) and due to effort involved getting down the cliff we nearly always stayed overnight. On the 'skull' trip we got to the clifftop to view the swell on arrival and there was still a 'westerly rollback swell' rolling in which was too big. We normally would have gone and fished White Rock at Bradleys Head instead but there was a gale-force westerly forecast for that night,meaning excellent fishing on the first morning after the big swell. Without knowledge of the westerly coming we wouldn't have gone down,but we decided we could always go and fish up on "Magpie" as it was still too rough on the lower ledges. Magpie was a 8x12ft wind eroded 'ledge' that sat about 60 ft above the sea on a section of cliff that was undercut and you could drop straight below into great snapper water. Only problem getting to magpie was a section where you had to lean in facing the cliff and shuffle along a foot wide ledge for about ten or so feet,then the ledge widened to about 3ft for about 10yards then a little wider at the spot. When you leaned in, at your back was a 60ft sheer drop to the water. After fishing for a few hours we decided to go back to our gear base 'the cave' as it's known,for a feed and to store our fish. We then went to climb back up on "magpie"(Eastern suburbs anglers club calls the spot 'scarecrow'- AFA(my old) club call it "magpie") to resume fishing. On this trip we'd taken a new member 'Bob' who was on his third trip down the cliffs, so mate Ross and I carried the gear and Bob had the torch. Ross inched across first followed by Bob,then I passed the rods along and leaned into the wall. Nearly at the 'wider' part you couldn't see your feet as several smaller protruding ledges about chest high needed to be negotiated past. Bob unknowingly shone the torch in my eyes and I became momentarily blinded- at the worst imaginable spot. I knew that any movement left was a 60ft drop to certain death,so I dived in to the right and belted my forehead on one of the small protruding ledges. I remember rolling left and then blacked out. When I awoke about half an hour later, Bob was kneeling just past me and was holding my left arm, I was on my back and my right leg was dangling over the edge. Ross had managed to climb past/over me and had gone back to the cave to grab the 50 metre pulley rope. I tried to move but was too dizzy,then Ross was back with the rope. They decided the only thing they could do was tie my left arm to the cliff in one direction and my left leg to the cliff in the other direction.No helicopter or other rescue method was possible from this location as it was a wind-eroded ledge,cut into a 400 ft high cliff wall and I remained there for about two hours until I felt stable enough to move,as I still had to negotiate the narrow part to get back to relative safety. All I remember about inching along that part of the cliff is that they re-tied the rope around my waist and one each about ten feet either side of me kept me in towards the cliff. That part negotiated and I managed to climb the eight feet back down to the cave. We were expecting four more guys from the club to join us during the night and just stayed at the cave until they arrived about 1am. We had a tiny first-aid kit(first time we'd taken one in years) that had 1 small bandage and someone put it on me. There was heaps of blood,but it had dried and matted with my hair. The sea got pretty big that night and we saw the lights of our mates coming down the cliff,some 800 metres away. It took them over an hour to do the usual 20 minute walk from the climb to the cave as they had to go well up into an area of huge fallen boulders about 100 metres back from the ocean to avoid the sea and nobody fished again that night. I still had to climb the cliff the next day and the boys put a 'safety rope' around me keeping the rope fairly tight as I climbed the 140 odd foot wall. I went to Western Suburbs Hospital and had a small skull fracture and delayed concussion. There are several reasons I put this whole story on. Firstly, Don't go rockfishing when the swells up even if the forecast/weather map are favourable,go home and return when suitable. Don't fish spots such as magpie where no help is even possible as things DO go wrong. Always have an adequate first aid kit. Take the time to formulate several 'emergency' strategies for worst case scenarios and make sure your "location and duration" are known to others so as to alert help

Had caught a bag of Luderick at the gutters at Fairy Bower and held up my biggest for the day for a comparison to my mates best one,it flipped free of my grip and I instinctively tried to catch it mid air. Bad move me! It turned 180 degrees and the clear tip on the front dorsal went underneath the nail on my middle finger penetrating about half an inch under and snapped off. I could see it clearly but couldn't get to it to get it out and nearly passed out from the pain. Had a Fortescue and a Black Trevally(Spinefoot)sting both shocking and fractured skull fishing(didn't feel that as out cold) but the Luderick spine was genuinely unbearable and agonising

In my humble opinion Mustad "Limerick' 8260's, Mustad 4200's and Mustad 7766 'Tarpon' are the most economical,efficient and durable hooks for ganging. If you can find some of the older "tinned" varieties rather than the newer "Duratin" treated ones even better as their corrosion resistance was far superior. Some older tackle shops may have a few- these came in the old white paper/cardboard boxes of 100 as opposed to plastic boxed 50's of today. 8260's and 7766's are straight, 4200's kirbed. In my opinion there's no need for a swivel/s in the gang/flight

There are a few other spots in the area,not as diverse as "White Rock" but worth a mention. If anyone is interested I can put the information on here also.

G'day mate fished the shoreline of Bradleys Head area for over 40yrs, from childhood and whenever it was too rough to go ocean rock fishing. The old stone wall near the mast of The Sydney facing up harbour is a reasonable spot for casting out wide(abt 70 mtr's to channel) for bream with a long rod, big lead and long trace- only bait to use is live worms due to long cast as they don't come off. Closer to the wall are a few flathead & lots of leatherjackets. It has also long been a top luderick spot,even after the destruction of the old wharf. Flathead caught here have often had heaps of small seahorses in their gut, so I guess there are plenty of them as well. There is a much better spot on the eastern front between Bradleys Head and Taylor Bay with access from either end. To get there from the Southern end,go down the road past the fort and the road turns left then back towards the city, you'll see a railing with steps. At the bottom of the steps you will be looking towards Sydney Heads. If the steps lead to a lighthouse you've gone too far,go back up and towards the heads. At the bottom walk to your left and about 250-300 mtr's north you will see a low platform Walk along the shoreline and there will be a white cliff face behind you when you get to the spot. This is "white rock or white wall" and it a great spot for many of the harbour's species. From the other end there is a track down that is adjacent to the entrance gate,walk straight down, don't turn left at the bisecting track as turning left it goes all the way around to Clifton Gardens and right goes to Bradleys Head, Just go straight ahead past the bench seat and follow the narrow track down to the water, which is the mouth of Taylor Bay, then go back towards the city. This way is a bit harder and you need to clamber around a huge boulder at high tide but quicker once you've done it a few times. Looking towards the water, the spot is made up of 4 main flat ledges covering about 35-40 mtr's of frontage with about a metre wide 'gutter' dividing these from the shoreline, to simplify things, from left A,B,C,D. SPOT 'A'- Only fishable from far left end as visible reef in front. Leatherjackets,Black Trevally(Spinefoot) in close and few luderick and odd Rock Blackfish at high tide. Long cast towards the heads with big sinker lands you on sand in about 5 mtr's of water. Mainly Bream off this end. SPOT"B'- Largest rock with a small pool on left end. This is the main spot for general fishing,with kelp patches on a sand bottom. You can either fish with small ball sinker(size 0,01,1)straight onto hook or a large sinker above a half mtr trace(leader) and 'long-cast' to marginally deeper water-roughly 6-7 mtr's at high tide. There are 3 chiselled rod holes on this rock and the small pool will accommodate about 4 yellowtail(live-bait) which can be caught here also. From this spot you can get Bream,Legal Snapper(Feb-May ) Flathead,Tailor,Trevally and Leatherjackets. I have caught and seen others catch Spangled Emperor here plenty of times & Live-bait on the bottom has produced Mulloway,Kingfish,Salmon.bigger Tailor and some good sized Flathead. Also the odd Hairtail and John Dory. Spinning here early morning often produces Tailor with occasional visits from Bonito and Frigates(Feb-Apr) I caught my largest (harbour-shore based) lure-caught Kingfish here also. SPOT 'C' - Not quite as big a rock with kelp covered 'slabs' on bottom both left and right with a 2 mtr wide 'gutter' in the middle.3 rod holes(2 in pools) on this rock. Long cast from here for Bream,Trevally,Flatties and Tailor. Odd better size Luderick and some mean Sawtail Surgeons behind kelp slabs. This is best Leatherjacket rock use paternoster rig size 6-10 longshank. Small Silver Drummer and heaps of Black Spinefoot usually spoil this as a Luderick spot. SPOT 'D' "The crack"- the far right-hand rock slopes into the water with a kelp-covered ledge only about a mtr lower and only half a mtr out. The "L" shaped gutter here is only 3 mtr's long and 2 wide. It is under 3 mtr's deep at dead low tide, but both kelp ledge and rock you stand on are 'undercut' and the entrance to a labyrinth of unseen cracks,gutters and holes. This is an excellent Luderick spot on the run-out tide only. The run -in see's BIG "EVIL" Surgeonfish "muscle" the Luderick away along with a few Rock Blackfish(Black Drummer). Night fishing here you can get same species plus Bream Red Morwong and a variety of 'crack dwellers'. Only drawback to this spot is you must stand in the water to fish the crack and most fish are there while water is thigh-deep-to-ankle deep. I've had some epic battles with Surgeons here and landed a couple of dozen over the years including a beautiful all blue one and plenty of Sawtails, although you lose about 9 out of 10 due to the terrain. Also if Luderick fishing here DON'T USE BERLEY! There's no need to as the fish are almost always in the crack on the outgoing tide and berley will penetrate the underneath Labyrinth attracting plenty of less desirable species, particularly Spinefoot(Black Trevally) Surgeons and both varieties of Drummer.- If you are new to Luderick fishing, the Bradleys Head stone wall is a much "friendlier" spot as there aren't any obstacles like at the "Crack" and there are heaps more fish. Although (Sept-Oct)- see's some trophy sized fish, you'll only get 4 or 5 maximum and importantly The Crack only fishes 2 guys if luderick fishing. The spot is so small, twice I've caught the same Luderick as the guy I've been fishing with when the fish took both our baits! GENERAL- The area of White-Wall/Rock fishes best from just on high tide until just before low tide, it isn't a run-in tide spot(except for evil lurking Surgeon's!) and if you fish the run-in you'll be disappointed. The only 'drawback' to 'The rock' is you have to get there at high tide which is ok on smaller tides,but anything over 1.5 mtrs you'll get your feet wet- it isn't at all dangerous but a little slippery in places. The spot goes just under water on tides of 1.65 mtr's and above, meaning ferry waves will flow over also, however these tides are generally more productive here due to this area is not affected by current. Other things of note are the Black Drummer can be numerous sometimes but always smell and taste like kelp, not at all tasty like their ocean brothers, but are always challenging to catch. There are crayfish along this shoreline in September-October, but as fishing laws have changed, they should be returned to the water if line-caught(we used to hand-line them back in the seventies) In May-June Tailor often school up out from here of a night and whole ganged pillies fished on the sand bottom will get a few. I hope this information is useful to you & anyone venturing to the area.

Red Crabs- (plagusia chabrus) haven't been mentioned in the post, They are nothing like the 'high shoreline crabs' mentioned previously. I entered the information for raiders who may be interested as there is little available.

Interesting read, the bream bait debate, I'm very surprised after reading all the posts that nobody has mentioned red crabs. When fishing the ocean rocks around Sydney red crabs are great bait for the really big fish.( I won't say anything is "best" because we all know bream eat just about anything) They are the the reddy-brown spikey variety that are often seen on the pylons of wharves in the harbour and live below the waterline on ocean rock platforms.(They are also the number one bait for big groper) Collecting them on the ocean ledges is not for the faint hearted as you plunge BOTH hands down a crack in amongst the red/brown weed,moving your hands along the crack wall until you feel the crabs and then either grab them off the wall or if there's heaps in there, bring both your hands together and swiftly lift out a "ball" of them. The crabs that bite-"scutleys,tanks,purples and scotchies" all run away leaving the reddies that cling instead of running. Reddies also have weak soft claws and don't hurt that much when they grab you. ALL the 'running crabs' hurt like mad but the 'system' works and you won't get nipped! It took me ages to get up the nerve but I'm ok with doing it now! You cut all the legs off the body,lift off the top shell from back to front and cut in half 1 leg threaded on then through the leg-socket holes of the halved (or quarters if really large) If you're worried about blue-ringed occies,they aren't there if the crabs are- same with green morays! Thick gloves would work also.Hook used is Mustad 92554 suicide in size 2/0, Give them a try,you won't be disappointed and they catch the big bream in daylight hours as well as night

Just wanted to add anyone reading this and thinking we were " jagging" the mullet- that 95 % of the mullet caught had inhaled the entire bait and only the odd one would be hooked on the outside of the lips and these would generally get away during the fight. Admittedly using the treble doesn't make for sustainable release but we generally kept our mullet for bait. A size 4 or 6 suicide or sneck would be a better option if you intend to release them

G'day mate when I was in my teens my mates and I used to fish for mullet in the upper Georges River quite often. We used slow taper luderick rods around 3mtr's long with centrepin reels and about 3kg line- pretty much the same set up that we used for luderick fishing. The rig was fairly basic too- a small running stem float set at a depth of between 2 and 4 feet deep(depending on the tide) a ball sinker heavy enough to weight the float so the entire ballast part of the float was submerged and about 15 inches below the sinker was a small treble about a size 6. The bait we used was fresh white bread which was kneaded around the treble's shank hiding it completely,other than the three hook points. This was the common set-up for about 10 of us who fished for mullet down the river and we used to catch heaps of mullet from 6 inches to over the 3lb(and sometimes even 4lb,though they were rare)mark. This same set-up we used at Lane Cove just downstream from the weir also and caught some really big mullet and quite a few bream. You can also get them on unweighted bread and for some reason they also like hamburger mince,which is more successfully used in 'cleaner' water but it takes a while to learn how to 'mould' it on properly. Also fished for them at Narrabeen both in middle creek and down near the lake entrance and caught plenty with the same rig/bait. The biggest mullet I've seen landed was caught by my brother on a Rapala CD3 in 'Red Clown' colour( which has also caught me a fair few) while whiting spinning down at Sisters Bay in Drummoyne. His big one was well over 4lb and took him nearly 20 mins to land on 4lb line. Hope this helps.

Nice story and nothing wrong with catching a few fish for a feed- maybe that other guy was jealous! Just for RAIDER'S information I spoke to council about lake opening and they told me it was being opened last Wed(14th March) at 9.30am. From previous experience/s of lake opening the fish and prawns really come on down near the ocean bridge and also at the 'drop-off' out in front of the caravan park and would be well worth a trip there.

G'day mate looks like a spangled emperor- caught quite a few in Sydney Harbour over the years and one of the guys in my team in a Sydney Metro Rock Championship got one almost 4kg on a pillie while tailor fishing at The Mattens at Dover Heights. Most of the ones I've caught have been under a kg but they fight hard and taste great. That's a nice one you caught great stuff!