Busted off in Dover Heights

[Yon]

I’ve been catching some decent snapper off the cliffs in Dover Heights lately, by fishing the light and tide changes. 
I’m fishing from really high up, so use a very heavy setup - 37kg rod and a big Penn reel spooled with 80lb braid and 120lb leader. 
Using that setup I’ve lifted everything from Luderick and large Snapper to small sharks up the cliff face. 
Tonight, for the third time in a row, I hooked into a monster. Not sure what it was, it took very short but extremely powerful runs and was pulling 20kg of drag without breaking a sweat. I had to lean all my weight against it just to keep hold of the rod. 
I managed to get it close to the surface a few times, only to have it take a dive that I couldn’t control. 
Eventually it reefed me and my braid tore before whatever it was went back to its watery home. 
I’m thinking it may have been a big stingray but honestly have no idea! 
If anyone has thoughts on what could fight like that around here, I would love to hear them. 
My whole body hurts from the effort! 

[onearmedfisho]

Probably a Hoodlum King

 

[Rebel]

Great report.

[Keflapod]

Hey Yon,

The info I'm using is:

1. the fight lasted at least several minutes.

2. the fish made short powerful runs.

 

If it was a king:

1. The fight would be over very quickly

2. The run (probably only need one in reefy country) would be sustained until the reefing

If it was a shark:

1. Likely a bite off quickly

2. If no bite off, the shark skin would scrape up the mono for at least a metre above the hook before biteoff

3. The runs are usually powerful and sustained (makos, bull sharks, bronzies and maybe other species)

4. They don't reef you

If it was a ray:

1. Depending on the ray species, they can be sustained or short but always powerful

2. The prominent species of ray off the rocks is the black ray and they are powerful but I'm unsure if their fight style is short runs or not.

3. Rays don't reef you but because they swim mainly across the bottom, they might accidentally rub you off

Also curious to know if that monster did you 3 times in the same session or once per session in 3 sessions?

Conclusion:

Probably a huge SNAPPER !!! Er no sorry I mean a large ray 🙂

 

 

[night_rider]

1 hour ago, Keflapod said:

Hey Yon,

The info I'm using is:

1. the fight lasted at least several minutes.

2. the fish made short powerful runs.

 

If it was a king:

1. The fight would be over very quickly

2. The run (probably only need one in reefy country) would be sustained until the reefing

If it was a shark:

1. Likely a bite off quickly

2. If no bite off, the shark skin would scrape up the mono for at least a metre above the hook before biteoff

3. The runs are usually powerful and sustained (makos, bull sharks, bronzies and maybe other species)

4. They don't reef you

If it was a ray:

1. Depending on the ray species, they can be sustained or short but always powerful

2. The prominent species of ray off the rocks is the black ray and they are powerful but I'm unsure if their fight style is short runs or not.

3. Rays don't reef you but because they swim mainly across the bottom, they might accidentally rub you off

Also curious to know if that monster did you 3 times in the same session or once per session in 3 sessions?

Conclusion:

Probably a huge SNAPPER !!! Er no sorry I mean a large ray 🙂

 

 

Like the info break down based on the fish!
 

I'm thinking that a ray would unlikely take a run near the surface...  The few times I've managed to lift large rays they seem to have emptied their battery and that's why I managed to raise them of the bottom... Thoughts?

Based on that I'm guessing something larger and aggressive. I hooked what looked to be a large dark kingfish, my guess at the time was AmberJack or Samson? Who knows, but it acted similar to what you describe and then took a massive run towards the large white floaty at Clifton Gardens snapping me off. 

Hypothesizing about the one that got away always gets me up that next 5am spot... Tight lines!

[PaddyT]

20kgsof drag?

[JAKSShark]

For someone who has caught some VERY LARGE STINGRAYS this fight doesnt really sound very similar... maybe a hoodlum or large snapper, maybe a decent tuna or something but i have no experience in the latter so dont know for sure

What rod reel were u using and was the bait on bottom or near surface?

[61 crusher]

From what you describe @Yon I wonder if it could be a small great white, I’ve never knowingly hooked one but we have a cold water band hard up against the coast & I have heard of a few recently being caught in the beach nets with the odd larger one along the central coast, Avoca region 

Back in the late eighties fishing the balconies (Bundeena) around this time of the year I hooked something that was like a slow bus idling along  on 25 lb mono & a heavy beach rod everything was strained to the limit & the only reaction I got was the odd big head shake & after 5 minutes & about to be spooled I grabbed hold of the spool & almost snapping the rod the line parted

After winding in & checking the working end I found the line to be all chaffed & roughed up

[JAKSShark]

Yes yon please tell us if you are certain it was reefed and not chafed from the skin of a shark and also did it take the bait and kind of move up the water column and speed up there or did it go straight down? 

[Scratchie]

37kg rod 80lb and 120lb leader with 20kg of drag??? 
And you got dusted? 
 

Definitely not a snapper 🤣🤣🤣

Scratchie!!! 

[wchh]

I have not caught anything more than 5kg off the rocks so limited of direct experience. From the way you described, and the fish won at the end, I would put it an eagle ray. I caught quite a few from the beach over 10 kg. Those were  always the fish harder to fight than a 20 jewfish.

 

[JAKSShark]

3 hours ago, Scratchie said:

37kg rod 80lb and 120lb leader with 20kg of drag??? 

Yes i forgot about this when i wrote it😆😆maybe a 3 metre flatty?😂

[PaddyT]

Didnt expand on my previous post but will now. In this day and age of braid lines that usually break at well above their advertised specifications and reels that are being marketed with ""extreme"" drag capabilities there is a very serious safety issue here especially for rock fishos.  As ive stated before i always check drags before going out after ""serious fish"" eg marlin, kings,tuna and large fast fish in general , and i check them through the rod with a set of scales (no guestimations !) and this is for two reasons A. So i can fish the outfit hard-strike drag at 1/3 of line breaking strain without being worried about breakoffs all being well and B. for safety-most normal human beings that dont have the first name Arnold cannot handle more than 7-8 kgs of drag for more than about 10 minutes WITHOUT a harness, one of my good mates is an extremly fit and muscular ex NRL player and the first time i had him on 8kgs of drag he was shocked at how quickly he was stuffed AND how easy it was to be pulled off balance by a heavy drag . The other issue is the safety of the rod and reel-picture this-20kgs of drag near a cliff edge and you hook a fast moving kingie while off balance (which happens all the time on the rocks)- what are you going to do? Its not that easy to open the bail arm a lot of the time when you have line under high tension so your only obvious thing to do is let go. Drags are their for a reason-its to let line out, i would strongly suggest that4-5 kgs of drag is about the max limit for safe rockfishing for fast hitting and moving pelagic fish-sure ive fished locked drag for drummer and groper before but im usually (in fact always) on low rock ledges fishing straight up and down at my feet-the rod tip gets pulled down -not out. The final point is that the only reels that will provide smooth drag pressure at such high settings are the high end offerings , the cheap end of the market simply doesnt have a drag "" curve"" , it just goes from loose to locked, dont be fooled by advertised drag specs.

[tyrone07]

I've heard of a species Terra Australis that always fights this hard, I reckon that's what you may have been fighting

[JonD]

My money would be on a big fat wobbegong, with it being in the Location constantly. 20kg drag is huge, most I can physically use is about 10kg on a standup bent butt game outfit for a short time.

Edited May 4, 2020 by JonD

[Yon]

On 5/2/2020 at 1:47 PM, Keflapod said:

Hey Yon,

The info I'm using is:

1. the fight lasted at least several minutes.

2. the fish made short powerful runs.

 

If it was a king:

1. The fight would be over very quickly

2. The run (probably only need one in reefy country) would be sustained until the reefing

If it was a shark:

1. Likely a bite off quickly

2. If no bite off, the shark skin would scrape up the mono for at least a metre above the hook before biteoff

3. The runs are usually powerful and sustained (makos, bull sharks, bronzies and maybe other species)

4. They don't reef you

If it was a ray:

1. Depending on the ray species, they can be sustained or short but always powerful

2. The prominent species of ray off the rocks is the black ray and they are powerful but I'm unsure if their fight style is short runs or not.

3. Rays don't reef you but because they swim mainly across the bottom, they might accidentally rub you off

Also curious to know if that monster did you 3 times in the same session or once per session in 3 sessions?

Conclusion:

Probably a huge SNAPPER !!! Er no sorry I mean a large ray 🙂

 

 

Sorry - been away from the net for a bit. Oh man... a huge snapper, or even a hoodlum, that would have been amazing. 
I fish that spot regularly (like 5 times a week) and encounter a monster like that at least once every three or four sessions. Not usually more than once a session. 
 

Thanks so much for the awesome breakdown, I think that whatever it was has earned its right to remain in the water! 

[Yon]

On 5/2/2020 at 3:57 PM, PaddyT said:

20kgsof drag?

Yes my reel has 20 kg of drag, it was locked up and still pulling. 

[Yon]

On 5/2/2020 at 7:25 PM, JAKSShark said:

For someone who has caught some VERY LARGE STINGRAYS this fight doesnt really sound very similar... maybe a hoodlum or large snapper, maybe a decent tuna or something but i have no experience in the latter so dont know for sure

What rod reel were u using and was the bait on bottom or near surface?

I was using a Penn Prevail II 12 ft heavy rod and a big Penn Spinfisher SSVI reel. 
bait was a squid head sitting about 3M off the bottom

[Yon]

On 5/2/2020 at 9:46 PM, 61 crusher said:

From what you describe @Yon I wonder if it could be a small great white, I’ve never knowingly hooked one but we have a cold water band hard up against the coast & I have heard of a few recently being caught in the beach nets with the odd larger one along the central coast, Avoca region 

Back in the late eighties fishing the balconies (Bundeena) around this time of the year I hooked something that was like a slow bus idling along  on 25 lb mono & a heavy beach rod everything was strained to the limit & the only reaction I got was the odd big head shake & after 5 minutes & about to be spooled I grabbed hold of the spool & almost snapping the rod the line parted

After winding in & checking the working end I found the line to be all chaffed & roughed up

That sounds *very* similar to what I was dealing with. Literally felt like a small bus, hard to raise up and seemed to be able to dive at will. 

[Yon]

On 5/2/2020 at 9:57 PM, JAKSShark said:

Yes yon please tell us if you are certain it was reefed and not chafed from the skin of a shark and also did it take the bait and kind of move up the water column and speed up there or did it go straight down? 

It took the bait and just started swimming off slowly, even after I tightened my drag, just kept kinda moving along. It didn’t start to really fight until I started trying to pull it up to the surface. 
I’m pretty sure it was a reef because I was able to move it through the water and then suddenly couldn’t. When I have it slack, it moved a bit and I was able to move it again, until it reefed me again. 
cant be 100% certain but felt like it was a reef 

Edited May 29, 2020 by Yon

[Yon]

On 5/4/2020 at 11:33 AM, tyrone07 said:

I've heard of a species Terra Australis that always fights this hard, I reckon that's what you may have been fighting

Hahahahaha - well that would be true “rock” fishing...

[Yon]

On 5/3/2020 at 12:35 PM, PaddyT said:

Didnt expand on my previous post but will now. In this day and age of braid lines that usually break at well above their advertised specifications and reels that are being marketed with ""extreme"" drag capabilities there is a very serious safety issue here especially for rock fishos.  As ive stated before i always check drags before going out after ""serious fish"" eg marlin, kings,tuna and large fast fish in general , and i check them through the rod with a set of scales (no guestimations !) and this is for two reasons A. So i can fish the outfit hard-strike drag at 1/3 of line breaking strain without being worried about breakoffs all being well and B. for safety-most normal human beings that dont have the first name Arnold cannot handle more than 7-8 kgs of drag for more than about 10 minutes WITHOUT a harness, one of my good mates is an extremly fit and muscular ex NRL player and the first time i had him on 8kgs of drag he was shocked at how quickly he was stuffed AND how easy it was to be pulled off balance by a heavy drag . The other issue is the safety of the rod and reel-picture this-20kgs of drag near a cliff edge and you hook a fast moving kingie while off balance (which happens all the time on the rocks)- what are you going to do? Its not that easy to open the bail arm a lot of the time when you have line under high tension so your only obvious thing to do is let go. Drags are their for a reason-its to let line out, i would strongly suggest that4-5 kgs of drag is about the max limit for safe rockfishing for fast hitting and moving pelagic fish-sure ive fished locked drag for drummer and groper before but im usually (in fact always) on low rock ledges fishing straight up and down at my feet-the rod tip gets pulled down -not out. The final point is that the only reels that will provide smooth drag pressure at such high settings are the high end offerings , the cheap end of the market simply doesnt have a drag "" curve"" , it just goes from loose to locked, dont be fooled by advertised drag specs.

Yeah I think that’s a pretty reasonable thing to say. I’m fishing from up high, behind a (low but strong) fence. The pull is always down, not out. 
I have thought about that scenario and seen people go in, so conscious of the risk you’re highlighting. Because I’m always slide baiting in that location, the drag is always loose and the rod in a holder, so when I set the drag, I’m always bracing already and on balance.  
 

[Yon]

On 5/4/2020 at 1:49 PM, JonD said:

My money would be on a big fat wobbegong, with it being in the Location constantly. 20kg drag is huge, most I can physically use is about 10kg on a standup bent butt game outfit for a short time.

Fishing from up high I just use my legs a lot more than my back. 
would a wobegong fight like that? I’ve only ever caught two. It was like pulling up a brick. 

[kingie chaser]

On 5/3/2020 at 4:26 AM, Scratchie said:

37kg rod 80lb and 120lb leader with 20kg of drag??? L
And you got dusted? 
 

Definitely not a snapper 🤣🤣🤣

Scratchie!!! 

Whiskers on roides 🤔🤫

[PaddyT]

are you 7ft tall and weigh 200kgs?