Some newbie questions on repowering

[YZ250]

Hi All,

I have an 1989 Haines Hunter V16R with a 1990 90hp mercury two stroke on the back.  The motor goes hard when its warm, but is a pain when its cold (very stally).  I dont mind it so much when im driving but it makes it hard for my partner to drive at the boat ramp when we are launching.  In addition, the kids hate the gentle aroma of billowing two stroke smoke whilst we are out and about so I have decided to repower.  I am looking at 90hp or 115hp motors I think.  Any more than that will be a weight concern with my low (20inch) transom.  

Firstly, I am reluctant (but not 100% opposed) to buying brand new as the cost of new outboards is frankly alarming.  Do they ever go on sale? I have only looked at online list pricing - is there any wriggle room in this?  I just balk at having to pay the same price as a brand new small car for just an engine.

Secondly, if I go the second hand route - what is considered low, medium and high hours for an outboard?  I have seen some for sale with 300 hours, and others for sale with 2000 hours on them.  How long will one get out of an outboard?  

Lastly, why does everyone have such strong views on brand A vs brand B?  I have done a bit of reading and find such polarising views on virtually every brand that it makes it hard to determine if there is any truth in it or not.  

Thanks in advance, i am new to this game so grateful for any help.  If its of assistance my boat is used in equal measures in the snowy lakes, local lakes (canberra) and south coast estuaries.  Another key reason for upgrading is to have more confidence in the motor when heading offshore (havent done that yet).

 

Brendan

 

 

[noelm]

There is no answer to how long an outboard will last, some go for decades and thousands of hours, some die early, the simple fact is, most will never wear an outboard out, salt water and neglect will kill it first. With proper care and regular maintenance a couple of thousand hours is achievable, as long as corrosion doesn't kill it.

[noelm]

As far as brands go, most are good, research the HP you want and check the weights of all the models, your Haines does not like a lot of weight on the back, but it does like HP.

[YZ250]

Thanks Noel.  I am happy with the 90hp two stroke on the back, but am leaning towards 115 in a four.  There doesn't seem to be much weight penalty in the 115s compared to the 90s, but I have noticed they jump a lot when you go up to the 130 bracket.  My boat is rated for up to 140 hp apparently.... however in 1989 a 140hp two stroke only weighed about 160 kilos.  

[noelm]

Yep, the weight is an issue these days compared to the "old days" the 115 Mercury seems to get pretty good reviews, but then, they all do.

[dunc333]

the 115 4stroke (new)  merc will be close to your power of your 90hp smokey but the 115 will use half the fuel and be so quiet you will keep turning the key when at idle thinking its not running till you get use to it . all brands are good these days its just how much you want to spend ,the main thing is to get it rigged and propped right and add a water seperator filter and new fuel lines to the boat and happy days. unless your lucky. buying a 2nd hand motor is a lucky dip at best. ,cheers dunc333. ps let us know your outcome

[noelm]

The Merc 115 will run rings around your old motor, however it's a very popular HP and not that common second hand in any brand.

[noelm]

Not many dealers will list a price on their website, don't know how many dealers you have close by, but it might pay to just go and have a look and get a feel for prices "first hand" 

[Rebel]

Try some of the guys who service boats. Sometimes you will find one with a re built motor with some warranty.

[YZ250]

Thanks gents. We’ve got a merc dealer locally, prob others too. I like the idea of quiet idling for trout trolling 

[dunc333]

i think the hole shot might be very similar due to weight difference and being a 2 stroke to 4 stroke .top end speed proberly the 115 4 stroke depends on how set up .so yz250 once you choose a new outboard let us know what you think .if you could do a top speed gps test before you remove the old girl so you have some numbers to compare to cheers dunc333

[kingie chaser]

On 3/12/2021 at 1:23 PM, YZ250 said:

Hi All,

I have an 1989 Haines Hunter V16R with a 1990 90hp mercury two stroke on the back.  The motor goes hard when its warm, but is a pain when its cold (very stally).  I dont mind it so much when im driving but it makes it hard for my partner to drive at the boat ramp when we are launching.  In addition, the kids hate the gentle aroma of billowing two stroke smoke whilst we are out and about so I have decided to repower.  I am looking at 90hp or 115hp motors I think.  Any more than that will be a weight concern with my low (20inch) transom.  

Firstly, I am reluctant (but not 100% opposed) to buying brand new as the cost of new outboards is frankly alarming.  Do they ever go on sale? I have only looked at online list pricing - is there any wriggle room in this?  I just balk at having to pay the same price as a brand new small car for just an engine.

Secondly, if I go the second hand route - what is considered low, medium and high hours for an outboard?  I have seen some for sale with 300 hours, and others for sale with 2000 hours on them.  How long will one get out of an outboard?  

Lastly, why does everyone have such strong views on brand A vs brand B?  I have done a bit of reading and find such polarising views on virtually every brand that it makes it hard to determine if there is any truth in it or not.  

Thanks in advance, i am new to this game so grateful for any help.  If its of assistance my boat is used in equal measures in the snowy lakes, local lakes (canberra) and south coast estuaries.  Another key reason for upgrading is to have more confidence in the motor when heading offshore (havent done that yet).

 

Brendan

 

 

Different sized motor of course but this might give you some insight into the thought & tech process in repowering

 

 

[pegz]

I repowered from a 90 Tohatsu 2 stroke to a 100hp 4 stroke Tohatsu. boat does sit lower in water at the back with the weight difference but goes like a cracker and very quite pushes the boat along at 38mph. Fitted cost 15k other makes were similar pricing within a couple hundred. also installed SLT10 trim tabs to get on the plane quicker and they do the job well i am pleased that i fitted them

[Tunastrike11]

On 3/13/2021 at 10:13 AM, YZ250 said:

Thanks gents. We’ve got a merc dealer locally, prob others too. I like the idea of quiet idling for trout trolling 

Merc yamaha suzuki honda are all good hours on engine depends on how often it was serviced i would compression test before purchase good luck.

[YZ250]

19 hours ago, kingie chaser said:

Different sized motor of course but this might give you some insight into the thought & tech process in repowering

 

 

Thanks for this link - that was a really great read.

[YZ250]

Thanks everyone - i will definitely report back when I have made the decision.  I wont be rushing in so that will take some time.  My visit to the Merc dealer was good - he reckoned 115hp Pro XS is the go.  He was worried 90hp would leave the boat underpowered.

[JonD]

Ive been in these a fair amount, like you say weight on the transoms is an issue, as is the additional fuel tanks down that end. The one I used had a Yamaha 115 and constantly had a wave come over the stern if you slowed down to quickly, even had water come over the back if two adults fished from the stern in a flowing sea. My neighbour had a bigger fuel tank made that fitted up under the front but this also came with a heap of issues, such as the fumes coming up from under the front and worse handling. 

Ive seem one of these fitted with an F70 (like what Ive just pm'd you about). Yamaha seem to of removed their performance data from their site which was pretty handy. In terms of performance there are numerous variables to what sort of performance you are hoping for. If you want the boat to get on the plane and get from A to B with good economy then a smaller engine with a smaller pitch prop will perform well for some people. Some people are looking for more top end speed to get from A to B and dont mind the bigger initial cost and larger service fee's etc. 

The boats are pretty narrow so not so much buoyancy down the back, not sure if a pod may help. As for my neighbours boat, he couldn't live with the smell of the fuel and got rid of it after spending thousands on it, shame as they are awesome little boats.

This is a boat that I would assume to be around the same sort of weight as yours, I seem to remember the data on a 16 like yours was a touch slower but like I said Yamaha have removed that data but they may be able to provide you with it. If I was to refit one with new transom and underfloor fuel I would personally be looking at the Yamaha f90. Like I mentioned in the pm I saw very little difference dropping from a merc 90 to a Yam 70 on my formula 15, only top end speed was effected and my overall performance was very close to the bellow screen shot.

 

Edited March 15, 2021 by JonD

[GoingFishing]

3 hours ago, YZ250 said:

Thanks for this link - that was a really great read.

I suggest you pm Zoran and pick his brains. Cant go wrong ! He is the master

[antonywardle]

Great read and a lot to consider. I'm pretty sure I'll be going the Merc 115 when its time to replace my 90ETEC. I think that their corrosion protection is pretty good. Pricing seems to be around 16K fitted from what I can tell. I'll also pop over to @zmk1962 to pick his brains too! 

[hucho hucho]

You can either go with 4 strokes Merc, yamaha, suzuki, honda or 2 stroke fuel injected Evinrude ETEC. Advantage of new ETEC is less servicing and weight. Service is required after 3 years or 300 hours.

Sorry, I've just read, that production of ETEC is shutting down!